Let's see, heatherscarlet, you say desperate for something to do. The last time I looked around Victoria, there were movie theaters, gyms, golf courses, parks, zoos, a mall, restaurants, historical places in Victoria and surrounding communities, the coast nearby, swimming pools, basketball courts, wildlife refuge nearby, hospice and red cross volunteer opportunities, summer softball/bowling leagues, etc., etc.. I could add more to this list.
And you say there is nothing to do. Get out of your house/apartment and find these things.

As a younger person in Victoria who has been watching the growth of the city over the past 5 years I believe that this would be a wonderful thing for our town. Every summer the children and young people in this city get out of school and are desperate for SOMETHING local to do and currently there is nothing. I believe that comparing this current plan to the failed park in the past is completely unfounded. Hello people the city has grown since then!! This will be a wonderful thing for this city...it's about time someone take steps to bring a theme type park to our area. I do agree thougth that a tax abatement may not be the best idea. Let this plan prove it's self first.

Seems like everyone has forgotten about the waterpark/go cart/miniature golf failure on the Houston Hwy & how long it was an eyesore. I agree with everyone else, he should be made to clean up his current property, it would go a long way towards his credibility.
Why didn't the paper cover the 80's reunion?

I agree with woofwoof, lets do something with Riverside park. A riverwalk would be great,,a waterpark? what a freakin lame idea. We had a water park and a gocart park,,and they both didnt last,,and they Sure didnt help the city. Lets THINK here Victorians. Been to S.A.? its beautiful. We have a park,,lets just Do something with it... As it is now,,its just mainly used for Golfers,,Not everyone likes to chase little balls around. A Riverwalk,,Great Idea woofwoof!!! OH,,and about the Zoo being flooded in the past?....Problem for this is the river is Not kept clean and free of debris,,such as Log jams,,Downstream....Take a trip downstream in a kayak,,You'll see..

Sales tax, thanks that reminded me I need to mail in it by the 20th.

The city sales tax rate is only 1.5 %, one and a half cents on each dollar of goods sold., the county gets half a cent for each dollar sold. The state receives 6.25 %.

For a business to rely on a 1.5% reduction on sales tax seems so small it is almost insignificant.

When you think about the cost of utilities ( not only water), payroll and payroll taxes, a increase in property taxes because of improvements, the cost of good sold, you know drinks snacks ect., and the cost of equipment, that 1.5% doesn't amount to much of anything in the total costs of operation.

If that 1.5% is a deal breaker, I would be amazed.

Interesting comments, each and every one. I attended the meeting last night and asked the council to review this carefully before making any decisions and specifically felt tax abatements should not be offered. A couple of points from the comments I think I can clarify.

First, the park would take in untreated water but then filter and treat it before using it. The presneter spoke about the pumps/treating equipment being built to where they can be hoisted up off the ground in the event of a flood. I find it hard to believe no additional water will be needed after the intial "fill up" but that is what was presented.

Second, I agree with the comments about the impact on surrounding businesses, the presentation was overly exaggerated. There is no way this park is going to create the number of jobs as presented last night and there is also no way the average wage is $32,000 a year. The presenter stated they estimated each person attending the park would spend $7.00 in other businesses. I personally don't see this type of attraction bringing in people from far enough away that they would stay in hotels overnight (needed to gain some of the hotel taxes for the city) but I could be wrong.

Third, I don't think this type of business venture should qualify for tax abatement. Abatements should only be used with large ventures that have a proven track record. Unfortunately water parks, go carts, batting cages and miniture golf courses don't have a very good record in Victoria.

On a personal level I think offering a portion of the sales tax collected IN PARK as an incentive is a unique approach. If the business plan presented at a later date is sufficiant to support POTENTIAL tourists coming to Victoria I feel a small sales tax play is justified.

I think the majority of the people in Victoria want to see new businesses develop, I just don't think many people think government subsidies are justified. I hope city council will consider this at a level much more detailed then being a "neat" idea.

Justamom, you and I are in complete agreement. Scroll down a little and read my first post.
Not only will the River Center stimulate sales tax revenue but also the hospitals, Dr. offices and pharmacies.

I hope City Attorney Thomas Gwosdz will have the foresight to require a "clean-up" bond to be be posted. Just because of the way Riverside Convention Center area looks currently.

I would rather see a Riverwalk type area built along the Guadalupe. That would act as an incubator for growing other businesses.

Um....am I the only one with a problem with this sentence:

He's proposed that water for the park come from a nearby city water line that transports untreated river water or from a water well.

Untreated? Um I don't think so. With the water from here even chlorine could not kill everything. No way my kid will be in the water. Gross.

Can all the "Good Old Victoria Boys/Girls" please step off and shut their traps. I believe that this is an excellent idea for our community. It would actually be nice to have a place to go to for a whole family to enjoy instead of having to drive 100+ miles. All ages could enjoy this park. To all you gripy old nags, shut up and sit back and allow change! Kudos to Homer and his idea. I have faith that the community can make this happen.

No I did not pick them up. It is a matter of respect. You just don't throw ur s**t on the ground. That's what I see going to happen with this park. These thugs go to the city park trash it and therefore wort off law abiding citizens from wanting to take their families to these establishments. Hopefully if this park goes up management will make sure to keep the place clean and sanitized. Unfortunately, I don't see this happening. He does not keep what he owns now up to snuff....

Well I guess we will have to wait and see in the next couple of weeks as to where the members will go with it.

I don't think government at any level should be in the position of deciding which business gets special treatment. Let there be a level playing field for all to compete. This business decision should made on it's own merits and whether it is viable and able to stand on it's own without government subsidies of any kind.

The concern I have is that Polasek thinks it's neat. If he thinks it's neat, then the mayor and Halapaska think it's neat. If that's the case, watch your tax revenue go pouring in to this project.

Citizen, you should be careful on your choice of words. Your opinon of Mr. Escalante is irrelevant. Do you know the man? If you wish to comment on the project, feel free. But keep the insults to yourself.

I would love to see this project come to life. The phase 2 parts would add a lot of stuff to do in this town. The seasonal jobs would be great for the youth still attending school. I saw some comments about the jobs beig low paying, and part time, in my opinion part time work is better then no work.
I worry about the chance of flooding, but I hope if they plan on investing that much into the park they have researched the flood issues.

It's not a tax abatement. It's a reduction in the sales tax. Money collected in tax, then discounted, then given to the city. It will be a tax collected that otherwise would have never been collected.

If water is the incentive, then it is being proposed that this water would be discounted. It would be raw water drawn from the river, then treated. It would have to be treated to meet health standards.

This is entreprenurialship at its best. It is developers wanting to improve their property by building a potential tourist/visitor attraction. What is the problem with that? It's their money. It's their risk.

Splashway in Sheridan is a case in point. A tiny town, far away from any major highway and yet that business succeeds and town benefits from it.

What are all of you so afraid of? Progress? Jobs? Growth? New people in our community?

One poster here complained about diapers in the Wal Mart parking lot. What did you do about it? Did you pick them up? Did you tell management that it was filthy and unsanitary? Or did you just drive away as fast as you could so you blog a complaint to which you brought no solution.

Victoria, you have reaped what you've sowed.

You have a no vision city council. You have status quo. You will soon have shrinking city. Then what will complain about? You will have all you wishes and happiness.

I don't have a problem with the city giving a discount on water as long as it is untreated. If you have been to Schilitterbaun it is just filtered river water. But No TAX ABATEMENTS of any kind, private business in Victoria needs to stay private. The city does need to make sure Mr. Escalante handles the parking correctly.

I do have to agree with most of the people on here, Riverside is not a good location. If I was investing my money I would have to pass on this.

I think this whole water park idea is so far fetched. We barely had enough water to water our yards with the drought this summer. How in the world are we going to have enough water to supply a water park. And the thought of building something that is supposed to be family oriented in thug ville is totally absurd. Have you seen the trash that hangs out in the city park in recent years? Not exactly what I would my children to be around. You can't go to Wal-Mart without having to step on dirty diapers in the parking lots; This establishment will amount to the samething. Disrespect and trash... JMO

A water park...seriously?? What a ridiculous idea! And these contractors have NEVER built a waterpark before?? You have to do your homework before you can pass the test!

The developers of the water park/recreational area are not asking for any monies from the city, they are just asking either for a reduced sales tax payment or reduction in water rates. Based on that, look at the big picture and realize that this park, which is being financed with private money and not taxpayer money, will be something that will attract people from the area and not just Victoria. As a matter of opinion, there probably is not a single business in Victoria proper who could survive just based the population of Victoria. This community needs outside money to help this city grow. This city has to grow or we will just be faced with more infrastucture problems.

Regarding the waterpark near the cemetery. The railroad is just as close and when a train goes by, you never hear any thing from a burial service. Relocating a proposed water park makes about as much sense as moving the train tracks. Just another petty complaint. Anyway, I don't think the "residents" of the cemetary are going to complain about the living having fun at a waterpark in the 100+ degree weather in a south Texas August.

If the Big 80's Class reunion that was held at Riverside Convention Center several weeks ago is any indication of how the owners run a business and keep it up, the City Council needs to run the other way QUICKLY!!!

The owners were so ill prepared in any and every way. From the nasty smoking area that had no place to dispose of cigarettes, other than the ground!! To the one hour MINUMUM wait for a beverage. Not to mention the poor parking that already exits and the old original toilets that do not flush properly!!

Riverside Convention Center could barely keep up with a steady crowd of 200 or so. I would hate to think of them handling a daily crowd of 1,500!!!

Just my thoughts based on my recent experience.

I can think of two water type parks that have failed in Victoria. I guess the third time is a charm.

This comment is troubling:
"He's proposed that water for the park come from a nearby city water line that transports untreated river water or from a water well. Once the park is filled with water, the only water needed after that would be to replace that which evaporates."

Untreated river water is not for me. Victoria is at the bottom of the river way. Sequin,Gonzales,Cuero. No thanks.

Anyone want to discuss the $32,000/year "assumed income" they used last night to embellish the water park's economic impact? That's over $15/hr full time, which won't be the case at all. They'll be lucky to create $16,000/yr jobs. Looks like the VEDC coached them on fudging numbers, and the council just eats it up.

The creation of 245 "indirect" jobs is another joke. Any indirect jobs created will be low-paying part-time jobs at restaurants, gas stations and maybe hotels.

This is an important topic because these overblown numbers are being used to determine how much of a handout to give the water park. Since tax abatements only apply to "industry", the park proposed a potentially-illegal sales tax rebate scheme and over-accounted for the city's portion of sale tax revenue. Taxpayer beware!

I don't have an agenda against the private water park, but I do have a serious problem with the water park's bloated sense of entitlement on display last night.

The idea of a waterpark / amusement center sounds great, but the location could not be worse. City needs to consider poor access as well as flood concerns. This type of recreation would be a lot more profitable off af a major roadway or loop. This whole Red River area is an eye sore. So would the convention center be torn down, or be left? I would have a lot more faith in this project if the owner took better care of the businesses he already was overseeing.

There's no doubt this type of business will benefit Victoria in many ways, but we really need to scrutinize the handouts the city might give. This project should be able to stand on its own. (Any argument otherwise is also an argument for lowering everyone's taxes to retain current businesses.) Plus, the proposed Airline water park needs to be revisited (scrapped). It was a bad idea BEFORE this private park was made public.

That is not the case SUPERDAD. I can less if he id green or purple. If he has the money and the backing then get after it. How ever, the build it and they will come theory is better left to the movie. I would love for venture such as this to work, and I think it COULD in the right economy. By the way has he set a admission price for the park yet? Will it be affordable for the community.

Build it and they will come.....

Who else is hiring and building for the sake of kids??? It could give older teens a summer job.

nonya don't stereo type because this guy is Hispanic and too has more money than you. He is even using a local contractor! I think the only thing to check is to see if the elevation is high enough from floods and PAINT THE 'CONVENTION CTR.' its so unpleasant to look at. uugggh

UgottaBkiddin - I would highly doubt that. This is Victoria. They might have a swim up church or bank though....

According to his proposal last night, they are only asking for a percentage of the sales tax revenue that they directly generate to offset the increase in property tax. According to him they did this instead of asking for a tax abatement. All indirect sales tax revenue from Restaurants, hotels, etc will go to the city. Remeber that the city gets 11% on all hotel stays. Seems reasonable if they can bring in that many tourists into Victoria. $12 Million increase in Sales Tax revenue would certainly help the economy.

Will this water park have a swim up bar?????

0325,
I give it to you, I did not see that pdf and thats my bad. The layout looks good, but his proposal for the water park portion is not worth building. As I said before, the venture for the rest of the park would be able to generate more sustainable revenue for him in the long run. You know as well as I do we do not have the water system to run even a small water park. I also am not a fan of giving him Mr. Escalante a portion of the taxable revenue. Now If that’s what the city wants to do, then I want the taxable revenue that I generate for the business I bring to this town from out of state businesses that have setup shop here and buy here. I all for anyone that has the gumption to start a new venture, but make sure the location is right and the city economy can support it in all aspects.

P.S If our paper would have reported the actual acreage amount the comments would have been different, but that’s the Advocate for you, do half way only and never research and print the whole story.

Citizen do a little research before your break it down. Do yourself a favor and take a look at the waterpark.pdf at the top of the article. You will realize, as I already stated. The waterpark is 3.2 acres. They have 17 additional acres for parking, batting cages, miniture golf, etc.

OK, lets brake this down.

He claims it is going to be on 3.2 acres. He claims he will have on the conservitave side 1500 a day. Ok, now let see how much room that will take up and if 1500 people will fit in that space.

1. Lets go with the avarage family size of 4 people.
1500 / 4 = 375 cars.
You will need 75,000 to 80,000 sqft to fit them that = 1.75acres used for parking.

Remember 1 acre is 43,560 sqft acres remaining 1.45 acres.
I have been on 1.5 acres, that is in NO WAY big enough for what he wants to do. I think our city needs to re think this as well as Mr. Escalante. If he wants to spend 6 or 7 million for this venture that will only be on a 1 to 1.5 acres he and his consultants have lost there minds. Now dont get me wrong I would love to see somthig here for the youth, but this plan is way out of wack. I want to see his business plan and I advise the city to do so as well along with the plans work up of the park. Everyone needs to keep in mind that we do not have the water system to suport such a park at this time. Now if he wants to put in a batting cage or paint ball and mini golf thats worth looking at for the family and youth. That would be a venture that is more likley to produce his venture a constant revenue base.

Why do people have to be so negative. I think it's a great idea. Give the guy a break I'm sure he thought about all this before he presented the proposal. Look at Schilitterbaun i'm pretty sure it started out small. Just look at their layout it's not all in one location you have to take a little shuttle to get another location. I'm not saying that's how big it would get, but with Victoria and the surrounding counties it could be a success if we support it.

1,500 people a day, somebody wake that boy up,nobody is going to that run down old park,beautify Riverside park first. We don't need to see all the gangsta boys with their cracks showing out of their pants along with all the tattoos, yea a real nice family atmosphere.

Hey folks, your not thinking...It's going to be a "Multi-Level" waterpark..geez , you guys just aren't thinking..:-)

The Convention Center is located on 20+ acres. According to the proposal the Waterpark is 3.2 acres. I am sure that 17 acres is plenty of room for a parking lot and everything else proposed. If you take a look at the master plan in the video you can see the layout of everything.

"...include a miniature golf course, go carts, batting cage and possibly a paint-ball course and bumper boats." All this AND a waterpark?? on 3.2 acres??

I'm with you VBB, I didn't even think about the parking too!

Somebody check the elevation map of that property. Claims to have built up the property 4 feet and be out of the flood plain sound exaggerated to me. Building up one acre 48" is 6453.31 cubic yards of fill. Go figure, an acre is 208.71 x 208.71
http://www.garden-ville.com/4376808_3...
The Texas Zoo flooded several times over the years.

Would 3.2 acres be big enough for everything he wants to do & have ample parking?