• Bighorn -
    another thought, unless your Vet friend has skills that he knows will be required by the local plant have him check with VC.
    They already have some VoTec training they are working with CAT on.

    Kind of like the petrochemical plants require the operators training certification classes before they will consider your application.

    If none of these are in his interest I would imagine in a few months the Safety Council in Port Lavaca will be doing training for them like they do for all the other plants, construction, and manufacturers in the area.

    I sincerely wish him and all Vets the very best.

    February 19, 2011 at 3:50 p.m.
  • DPridgen--

    I'll take your word for it. I guess when I am passing by in my daily business, I am just missing all that activity.

    Never fear, though--When the first excavator rolls out of the gates, I will gladly apologize for having doubted VEDC's brilliant coup.

    And possibly it would help if the VEDC took down the "320 acres for sale sign".

    February 19, 2011 at 12:53 p.m.
  • Bighorn –
    Please tell your young Vet friend:
    1) Thanks for his service to the USA.
    2) Go to

    With all CATs worldwide operations each country appears to have their own careers site. Aside from being in all kinds of publications, I found it when Googling “Caterpillar Victoria Texas”.

    Jared is correct.
    I too know of CAT folks that are living in VCT, and have been since at least October with their spouse and have put homes in other states up for sale.

    Now for the CAT facts.
    I have a birds-eye view from my 2nd floor office at GEMCO as do others.
    In December we got tired of trying to figure out what was happening and I received the early Christmas gift of a set of binoculars so “we could see better”.

    Here is what I and others have witnessed, from our facility:
    1.Permit signs as required by law have been posted since October or so.
    2. Surveyors were out there for days on end. Estimating 2 weeks.
    3. Two backhoes trenching. Probably to verify buried pipelines.
    4. White helicopter on site at least one day with an emblem on the side near where one of the backhoes was digging.
    5. Numerous vehicles, all shapes sizes and colors, parked up and down Lone Tree looking at Plans layed across hoods and tailgates.
    6. ATVs all over the place.
    7. And, last but not least what appeared to be some type of water pressure test.

    Those ole boys and gals are sure gonna be fit to be tied when they find out they wasted their time on this non-existent project. I’m sure would they all would have much rather been inside drinking coffee where it was warm, not windy and, or not raining.

    February 19, 2011 at 12:33 p.m.
  • My dad was stationed at RAF Greenham Common, with the Cruise Missiles.
    There were no medical Facilities there so they had to go to Upper Heyford. When my mom was getting ready to give me birth, they were on their way to Upper Heyford. Half way there, I couldn't wait to come out. My Mon yelled, I'm not going to make it. My dad saw a hospital sign, turned in. It was a Nuns Convent in Basingstoke.

    February 19, 2011 at 11:56 a.m.
  • Jared, we'll just have to wait and see, I guess. Time will tell.

    February 19, 2011 at 10:15 a.m.
  • @EA, my advice for the koolade, switch it to cranberry and offer some vodka ;), I really prefer beer though.

    Coming from my industry, construction takes time, especially a project this size. Another example is the power plant by Coleto, the builders have been chosen like 8 months ago and it is still proceeding and ironing out the details. I don't know the grand total of CAT employees already here, but I know of at least 3 that have already moved and know of a few more that are visiting every couple of months picking out houses, finding schools, day cares etc.

    I also know many logistics are already being worked on: study of highways, port travel (access to water, not wine ;)), negotiations with their suppliers with their new location in mind.

    I realize that any project can stop until the first excavator rolls off the assembly line, but from what I can see all systems are go. Not all this info comes from VEDC by the way, I have a keen sense of remembering people so I see them around town, eating out, community involvment with other associations, etc.

    February 19, 2011 at 10:01 a.m.
  • I know a young veteran who returned from Iraq, wants to stay in his hometown of Victoria, and contacted CAT HR about possible employment/training. They informed him it was much too soon to project employment on this tentative operation.

    February 19, 2011 at 9:56 a.m.
  • Jared--

    Really? Folks are already buying homes? Why are they already buying homes? Are they going to just sit and watch the milo stubble continue to grow?

    I hope you are right. Victoria needs this plant. But if I am right, then it going to be a big embarassment for our leaders.

    I do believe you believe what you've been told. Since you are able to attend the Tuesday morning koolade sit and sips, get a start date for this project if you don't mind and bring it back here for the rest of us. Thanks.

    February 19, 2011 at 9:50 a.m.
  • You would have double the shares.

    February 19, 2011 at 9:33 a.m.
  • This comment was removed by the site staff for violation of the usage agreement.

    February 19, 2011 at 9:29 a.m.
  • @EA, ok. Thanks. I do know that there are some CAT employees coming down and buying homes, etc., I assume you know this, so my next question is, do you think they are not going to build something but have something else in mind?

    @Rebecca, I know right. I have been watching it for 2 months or so. Had I bought 2 mos. ago, it would have gained like 12 bucks per stock!

    February 19, 2011 at 9:20 a.m.
  • (Is that the same CAT? They are about to split their shares. I don't know what I'm talking about, but I have a computer.)

    February 19, 2011 at 9:20 a.m.
  • (Their stock was WAY up the other day.)

    February 19, 2011 at 9:04 a.m.
  • Yes, Jared, that is my opinion.

    February 19, 2011 at 9:02 a.m.
  • @EA, I am curious, do you really think CAT is not going to be building here?

    February 19, 2011 at 7:29 a.m.
  • Lammpost--

    You said, "I think I look great in a Cowboy hat."

    I said, "I don’t believe we are going to see any CAT equipment built in Victoria. Ever."

    I'm willing to call it a draw. What say you?

    February 18, 2011 at 8:24 p.m.
  • No way!

    I'm originally from Ascot!

    February 18, 2011 at 8:02 p.m.
  • Thanks, actually I'm from:
    Newbury, Berkshire - a civil parish and the principal town in the west of the county of Berkshire in England.

    February 18, 2011 at 7:57 p.m.
  • Surffree--

    I am so flattered that you think I have influence! Oh, but were that so...

    You need to read all of the comments though, because I have never said I had a problem with the Patillos owning anything that they own. I do have a problem with the city providing free parking lots.

    Surffree, I really don't mind you criticizing everything I write, but at least get the information straight. When you've done that, then feel free to continue, but do tell me why you seem to focus on my comments and not some of the others who also disagree with you. I'm curious.

    February 18, 2011 at 7:45 p.m.
  • legion357 - That may have been what was proposed but based on reading and interpreting the resolution, it states that the owners will build 13 spaces on their land, at their own cost, and will pay for 54 spaces additional spaces. Both parking lots would be available to the public. I could be reading the online document incorrectly or misinterpreting.

    EdithAnn - It seems as if you would have a problem with these owners even if they bought the land and donated it to charity. I do have you down for a big bowl of claim chowder on the " I don’t believe we are going to see any CAT equipment built in Victoria. Ever." If you keep thinking this way you can probably keep Victoria at its amazing 2% growth when compared to Texas 20% growth.

    February 18, 2011 at 7:22 p.m.
  • Wait a minute, I thought the portion of parking the pump house owners would pay is only for lighting. Not the actual parking spots.

    The city provides the land, material and labor for the parking spaces. That's the way I understood it.

    February 18, 2011 at 6:59 p.m.
  • Surffree—

    The original plans are relevant because, if there had not been a great deal of uproar, the City would have gladly left us believing that the Patillos made the ultimate sacrifice for the good of the community to take this burden off our hands for a song, saving the city almost $200,000.00 in demolition costs.

    Sounded good until we got to the part where the ORIGINAL plan from the city, regarding the parking lot, was going to take a $182,000.00 investment from the city. Does this truly, truly,
    TRULY make sense to you? Are we going to provide parking to every new business? What happens if the business goes belly up? The City is stuck maintaining a parking lot indefinitely.

    And so, of the original 117 desperately needed parking spaces, only 40 are needed now?

    I get so tired of folks not paying attention and thinking the rest of us are not paying attention either.

    You don’t have to worry about me going anywhere with Pat_Murph {{{shudder}}} in anything made by CAT, or any other vehicle. I don’t believe we are going to see any CAT equipment built in Victoria. Ever.

    February 18, 2011 at 5:39 p.m.
  • N45BA - I prefer to speak in facts and not hearsay, fairytales, and conspiracy theories.

    You stated "You'll soon find out how much of the 100% the restaurant owners will pay" Well the good news is that "soon" came on Tuesday when the resolution was signed. Fact: It states they will pay "$48,527". It also states that "Premises will not begin until full payment of the 4502807 has been received by City".

    Let me just go ahead and get this one out of the way for you:
    You Watch - Pat Murph and EdithAnn will be driving a Caterpillar front loader, down main street, with a Texas Tech Masked Rider, A&M Ol' Sarge, and Bevo in the scoop. They will head down main street on the way to downtown where anyone who has worked on a committee will receive old school white money bags with cash falling out of them.

    February 18, 2011 at 5:25 p.m.
  • laMpost you are conffusing. I dont understand were u stand on the issues.

    I watced the council meeting from thise week. why did hagan vote for the food place parking ? last time he vioted agin it. i thought he was helping us stop this waste!

    February 18, 2011 at 4:08 p.m.
  • KyleC, I don't know. I look at the comments here and laugh. I would swear many of the people are just arguing buddies. Not that I think it shaddiness is good business and should be done, but Lampost left me rolling:
    "Dealing from the bottom of the deck is the only way to go!" which must be read in context of someone just wanting to egg someone in a small way.

    Justataxpayer also has his wit.

    There is also some guy from England that drops pretty funny lines. Have a great weekend Kyle, if you go to M & M order the carne guisada deluxe burrito, I miss that jumbo tortilla packed with pure delight!

    February 18, 2011 at 2:55 p.m.
  • EdithAnn - Not sure how plans or discussions that are no longer valid are relevant but you stated that you watched the meeting and I am sure you have read the document that is online regarding this resolution(i.e. what actually happened and not rumors or hearsay). I am paraphrasing but it looks like the owners will build 13 spaces on their own property and pay 100% of the construction costs of the additional 54 spaces that the city/public can use.

    To summarize:
    There was a city owned property that was in ruin, the city was spending money to maintain, the city opened it up to public bid for any use, the highest bidder won, the new owners are building parking on their own property, the new owners are paying for construction of additional parking that the public can use, the city removed a expense and turned it into a tax asset, the city gets private owners to pay for public parking.

    February 18, 2011 at 2:42 p.m.
  • "I often hear how Victoria is backwoods, old school, hickville, etc. and I find it true in some regards, but you would never get that reading comments online!"

    Jared, do we read the same website?


    February 18, 2011 at 1:38 p.m.
  • I have to admit, I think Victoria has some of the most interesting characters. I get so many laughs reading through the comments online. And most of them are witty smart which is my favorite kind of humor!

    I often hear how Victoria is backwoods, old school, hickville, etc. and I find it true in some regards, but you would never get that reading comments online!

    February 18, 2011 at 1:35 p.m.
  • And on it goes. Same song second verse.

    Those lowlife politicians are at it again. Investing in our community, trying to bring business and/or educational opportunity. And they didn't even ask our opinion first! That is what my vote for my city council representative means doesn't it. Before they make a decision they should get a consensus of the people or at the very least my agreement. Geez!

    If it's another business good that translates into tax dollars. If it is an education system that wants to grow, good that translates into educational opportunity for our young adults.

    If you want to know before it's made public, run for office, get elected and serve in capacity that makes you a part of the decision making process.

    Otherwise give it a rest already.

    February 18, 2011 at 12:50 p.m.
  • Surffree—
    I believe that the Patillos were the only bidders. And I also believe the original discussion regarding the parking spots was about the Patillos partnering with the city in an 83/17 split on the costs. The Patillos were going to chip in just $31,200.00 while the city was going to foot the $182,000.00 balance for 117 spaces. This was the original plan, sold to the city council, based on the fear if the city didn’t participate in this wonderful deal, the Patillos might be stingy with sharing any spots they were forced to build.

    We all know, though, lots of discussion has changed this deal into something that no longer resembles the original concept, except the City is still as generous now as they were then.

    You haven’t learned how to use your secret decoder ring, yet?

    February 18, 2011 at 11:59 a.m.
  • N45BA - Sorry I didn't know you would miss me so quickly and someone has to work and create jobs and not just write posts.

    Riverside - It was an open bid, to all of the public. So I don't find it a coincidence that someone who also happens to be on the planning commission won the bid. The highest bidder won. Period

    With regards to parking, didn't the owners of the property agree to buy additional parking spaces from the city and pay for the construction? Isn't this the reason why it received 6 "ayes"?

    February 18, 2011 at 11:30 a.m.
  • All I want to know is who is going to play Lucy? Gggggrrrrrrrrrr.

    February 18, 2011 at 10:40 a.m.
  • im guessing the city can side step the lobbying issue buy funneling the money through VEDC

    February 18, 2011 at 1:05 a.m.
  • onestar said: "I have it on good authority (from a friend in the PD) that this money is going to VEDC to pay for a lobbyist to move UHV out of Victoria.
    It's going to VEDC so it can be kept secret until the deal is done and the public won't know."

    Whoa! If this is true, is it legal? I thought they needed to approve lobbying in open meetings with full disclosure. And why would the City be funding a UHV-related "fishing trip"? Are they looking to bring in another U system, like TAMU of TT? Is this within the scope of City govt?

    IF this is true, it sounds like someone (Crossroads Comm on Ed?, TREPAC?) didn't like the cards they were dealt on the UHV pasture expansion and/or the 'Road to Nowhere' and decided to deal their own hand from the bottom of the deck.

    I hope you're wrong.

    February 17, 2011 at 10:58 p.m.
  • @onestar...I believe the post from Saltgrass has more validity...
    @N45BA...You state," out of the clear blue sky, parking in a remote and seldom used area of Riverside Park was such a serious issue requiring an immediate resolution by our council"
    Why? the extra funds they needed came from making home owners having to cut grass on property own by the city. That grass which home owners pay taxes on to have the city cut their own grass.

    February 17, 2011 at 7:40 p.m.
  • IF that is true, then IMO, it is a waste of $.

    With state funds for higher, and all, education being cut by the state, to pay a lobbyist to try and get more funds from the state so another system can take over and build in Victoria is absurd.

    February 17, 2011 at 5:51 p.m.
  • i have it on good authority (from a friend in the PD) that this money is going to VEDC to pay for a lobbist to move UHV out of victoria.

    Its going to VEDC so it can be kept secret until the deal is done and the public won't know

    Can the Advocate confirm or get this denied. I cannot give my friends name cause he would be in trouble

    And when did the City council take a vote to move UHV out. Is the city spending public funds for private wishes of certain members of the city council

    February 17, 2011 at 3:56 p.m.
  • N45BA - I feel dirty for getting in the mud with the negative pigs that troll these message boards. As the saying goes, you both get dirty but the pigs enjoy it.

    Again, I would encourage our city leaders to support growth and to encourage private citizens that take risks to support this growth.

    February 17, 2011 at 12:28 p.m.
  • Dear City Council,

    Please read the following article from CNN about the City Council from Bell, California last year. Blood is still running in the streets.

    February 17, 2011 at 8:37 a.m.
  • Has some other telemarketer taken over the former StarTek property? Can't the city seize their property for not paying the back taxes? I suspect if any of us failed to pay our property taxes, a public auction on the Courthouse steps would take place.

    February 17, 2011 at 5:28 a.m.
  • Yes, that is what is supposed to happen but I thought Gwosdz has said that the city was not going to go after them for said taxes.

    February 16, 2011 at 11:33 p.m.
  • vbb, I believe that StarTek violated the contract between them and the city, and because of that violation, have to pay the taxes.

    February 16, 2011 at 10:58 p.m.
  • But, the citizens of Victoria can breathe a sigh of relief that it was only 100k that was requested as that is chump change to these guys, if it woulda been 1 mil it would of been approved just as easily. Y'all dodged a bullet!

    February 16, 2011 at 8:53 p.m.
  • Or it could be an investment akin to the StarTek debacle that left the city holding the bag on the property tax.....the city seems to have more failed ventures than successes (Cat isn't up & operating yet so you can't count those unhatched chickens).

    February 16, 2011 at 8:50 p.m.
  • I forget--have they broken ground (for actual construction) on that CAT plant yet?

    I need to take a drive out that way and take a look.

    February 16, 2011 at 7:48 p.m.
  • N45BA - Who says the city gave permission to build a restaurant? The city sold a piece of property. You could have bid on it. Did you?

    The two people that voted against the $100k, vote against everything and seem to be the epitome of risk averse, against change, non-winner mentality that I mentioned earlier.

    Would you have invested in the Caterpillar deal a year back if you knew what we all know now? I would have.

    February 16, 2011 at 7:42 p.m.
  • I'm watching the meeting right now. Why is it that when the Mayor knows the vote is going to be split, he'll ask for a show of hands. When he thinks everyone seems to be in agreement, he'll ask, "All those in favor signify by saying aye..."

    Does he just have a problem hearing the word 'no'?

    February 16, 2011 at 7:29 p.m.
  • @surffree...I apologize if you feel I jumped on the wagon to criticize you, but as leaders, without going into detail we could be informed as to the type of venture our monies are going into.
    It's hard to believe 2 individuals sitting on the same board have totally differents opinions as to the success of this "economic development project".

    February 16, 2011 at 7:16 p.m.
  • @surffree...You stated: I hope the "leaders ignore the people" that are risk averse, against change, and OK with the status quo(people that have more time to comment and complain on every article instead of becoming successes or improving this city).
    I think you are kind of late in making this comment.
    However, the City Council leaders have ignored the people, especially when we have never been in the loop in the first place.

    February 16, 2011 at 7:07 p.m.
  • surffree, please remind us the history of victoria leaders thinking 'big' pre caterpillar plant

    February 16, 2011 at 6:11 p.m.
  • I applaud these leaders for not accepting the status quo and having the ability to "think big" and to make these actions with a relatively low dollar amount. This town needs change. Big changes and big rewards require risk. I hope the leaders ignore the people that are risk averse, against change, and OK with the status quo(people that have more time to comment and complain on every article instead of becoming successes or improving this city).

    Thanks to these leaders for being the ones that see things differently and won't stand for the loser mentality that has penetrated these message boards. As a town we should decide to be winners. Lets turn up the volume of the people that have been winners in the past and present and decrease the volume of the people that have a history of losing.

    February 16, 2011 at 4:35 p.m.
  • maybe the 100k is to throw a going away party for pat murf ?

    is so, ill throw in another 100

    February 16, 2011 at 4:34 p.m.
  • I want to be ... the yellow school bus that makes an unnoticed and unwelcomed appearance in the background of one of the scenes. Oh, wait, that was The Alamo.

    February 16, 2011 at 1:49 p.m.
  • oUt of control........

    millions and millions waatsed.

    February 16, 2011 at 1:46 p.m.
  • Who shot the city budget?

    February 16, 2011 at 1:26 p.m.
  • For your information...and to stop all these negative comments and stop rumors, I did some undercover work to find "the rest of the story".
    Allison Miles • Originally published a story concerning (2011 Bring your Boots Ads Unveiled) February 1, 2011 at 3:48 p.m.,.
    On this article, seems some of the same persons posting here questioned why Victoria could not entice Movie Producers to come to Victoria or surrounding area and make a movie.
    Some of the Council members while at the City Park and going over the construction of and payment for parking spaces in Riverside Park remembered reading that the movie "Dallas" was being revitalized. The decision to entice the movie Producers to come to Victoria and film the "Dallas TV Series" came into play. Due to expenses of filming a show of this caliber the money amount could not be readily made available. Any further questions can be answered by reading the TV guide.

    February 16, 2011 at 1:10 p.m.
  • This is the way new industry is brought into our area. It will bring jobs that will support our tax base. Now we must speak up and tell Austin hands off our childrens education! We must improve the graduation rate and insist on young citizens are prepared to compete with other states and countries.

    February 16, 2011 at 11:31 a.m.
  • Kind of like the grabbag game--give me $5 and you might get a prize worth $10. But you also might just get left holding an empty bag.

    February 16, 2011 at 9:59 a.m.
  • My vote is for something associated with improving private property for individual owners. Mr. Hagan's comments regarding private businesses funding this "project" is telling. Do private business owners want taxpayer money to front the project? Next will be tax dollars to build the infrastructure and then the private business owners make a killing selling their now fully improved property. Maybe they want to convence someone to come to town so Airline can be extended (roberttx idea). Will be interesting to see if this is truly economic development or private owner enrichment.

    February 16, 2011 at 9:39 a.m.
  • left off the weekday morning HWY 87N traffic jam debacle that occurs as a result of the poor planning that went into the two new schools out there.

    February 16, 2011 at 8:15 a.m.
  • Radio babe posted; I'm wondering whether any of the negative bloggers have ever had a class in economics.
    El69runner, could you please clarify which type of economics your referring to:
    Between positive economics (describing "what is") and normative economics (advocating "what ought to be"); Thanks

    February 16, 2011 at 7:27 a.m.
  • Reality...
    "The return on investment of $100,000 will be a thousand fold on this," Truman said.
    Hagan said. "because of the uncertainty of its success I don't think it would be prudent to spend $100,000 of taxpayers' money".

    How can two persons sitting on the same board have such an indifference on the success of this project?

    councilman Paul Polasek. "There's a strong chance that less than half of that could be spent as I understand it.
    Your entering into an endeavor and are not sure how much it will cost you.
    And all we are guaranteed at the end of the day is; Well, we gave it the good old college try.
    One thing I learned a long time ago...things seem so much promising with someones else's money. How quick would the council be willing to commit themselves if this was their money?

    February 16, 2011 at 7:10 a.m.
  • I would like to tell you what I think but my stomach is getting sick.

    February 16, 2011 at 7 a.m.
  • I'm wondering whether any of the negative bloggers have ever had a class in economics. Let's talk about Catapillar. They estatmate that they will create 500 new jobs. That translates into (and I'm probably being conservative) upwards of $15 million dollars per year in payroll now circulating through our economy that wasn't there before. Then there are the indirect jobs that are create to support and build the new facility, again, putting millions of dollars of new money into our local economy.

    Even if the new project is a quarter of the size of the Catapillar project, I would think that a rational person could do the math and realize that even a potential of $4 million in new money enterting our ecomony year after year after year is worth a $100,000 investment.

    Excellent vote on the part of our elected officials.

    February 16, 2011 at 6:46 a.m.
  • I think if the $100K brings something to Victoria - all these people will be standing and taking a bow! If the deal goes south - they all ride off into the sunset hoping we forget that they approved the $100K.

    February 16, 2011 at 6:24 a.m.
  • I can understand the hush-hush on who they are courting, but why not some hint of what this is to be spent on? Free meals, vacations, what?

    February 16, 2011 at 5:30 a.m.
  • Just 100k, don't sweat it. I hope they build a Kmart. Better yet, something to do with auto or truck manufacturing. I like to build stuff.

    February 16, 2011 at 1:28 a.m.
  • and the airline extension finally got it's seed money

    February 16, 2011 at 12:43 a.m.
  • Unmarked expenditures, Riverside Pork.... are we in the Twilight Zone?

    Why didn't they go for the hat trick and give the CVB another wad of cash?

    February 15, 2011 at 11:53 p.m.
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    February 15, 2011 at 11:16 p.m.