• SWWW,

    I guess you are right. When I wrote that post, I was thinking about when my kids applied for their DL. They had to bring BC, which basically proves citizenship.
    I have no idea what my mom had to do when she go her DL.

    April 29, 2012 at 10:51 a.m.

  • Born..."She was able to use the expired DL for her "proof of citizenship."

    I'm not doubting your statement for one moment. However, I am wondering when the state began accepting a driver's license as proof of citizenship. There is nothing either on the license or in the process of obtaining one (at least there wasn't when I obtained mine) that verified citizenship. With the photo and signature, it will certainly verify a person is who he claims to be, but it cannot verify citizenship. I have a friend who is a German citizen who is working here. He has a driver's license, but that doesn't mean he is a U.S. citizen.

    April 29, 2012 at 10:42 a.m.

  • Good point,I didn't think about that computer savy  Legion,but the elderly are my peeps...:-)
    I was lucky, my company provided us with a SS rep. who explained the process to us.
    Wherever us elderly folks meet,we trade tips but I've never heard any complaints..As I've said before ,some of my old friends are going back to work...I didn't know you can stop current SS payments and restart them after you retire for good with a new calculated sum.

    You are right the Feds computer system and software are the worst....I think it's because they try to do everything in house and their IT are not the best.

    April 28, 2012 at 6:51 p.m.

  • Also when we went to the window, none of the information I typed in to get the number seemed to matter, the person asked the same questions again.

    April 28, 2012 at 6:27 p.m.

  • I guess mom should have done that B2M & Mike. One other thing, the take a number is a computer, my mom took one look and said "You do it, I don't know how." Sense most people that go to the SS office are elderly and are not computer savvy, I thought a regular old pull the number out thing would be better.

    April 28, 2012 at 6:24 p.m.

  • I'll post the link again it shows the "Real GDP Growth Rate Forecast" not the actual inflated GDP growth, there is a difference.

    April 28, 2012 at 6:11 p.m.

  • You don't need a SS card all you need is the last four digits of the SS number. The SS number is on the 1099 IRS form that is sent out to each taxpayer. I lost my SS card and I wrote the SS administration to verify that the number I was using was correct, they confirmed that it was after a couple of months.

    But you're right the SS administration is a vast bureaucracy that like all bureaucracy displays no sense of urgency - that's what we have to look forward to when Obumacare really starts.

    I looked up a review of John Fund's book on voter fraud. Below are a couple excerpts from that book review and why there is a concern about it. I had to chuckle about Mexico having a more secure voting procedure than we do - good grief! All this voter fraud concern really heated up with the revelations about ACORN/SEIU voter registration fraud and some accounts about giving absentee ballots to illegal aliens. This should be a concern for all Americans regardless of political party.

    "Ironically, Mexico and many other countries have election systems that are far more secure than ours. To obtain voter credentials, the citizen must present a photo, write a signature and give a thumbprint. The voter card includes a picture with a hologram covering it, a magnetic strip and a serial number to guard against tampering. To cast a ballot, voters must present the card and be certified by a thumbprint scanner. This system was instrumental in allowing the 2000 election of Vicente Fox, the first opposition party candidate to be elected president in seventy years."

    April 28, 2012 at 6:01 p.m.

  • Wow,Legion that cancels my pleasant experience I had at our local office but my records were in Victoria..I called and made an appointment about 3 months before I retired ,took a number but I can't remember how long it took but the representative was nice ,professional,helpful,and accurate to the penny...but that was 5 years ago.

    All kinds of predictions out there,I'm sure you can find a gloomy one of choice for those rooting for failure....Point is voter I'd is not about this economy and it's more than 4 digits as the links I provided proved.
    Our country is resilient and we will bounce back and this one of many that agrees.

    "WASHINGTON (AP) — The Federal Reserve has boosted its outlook for U.S. economic growth this year and is slightly more optimistic about the unemployment rate, reflecting improvements in recent months.
    In an updated forecast Wednesday, the Fed predicted that the economy will grow between 2.4 percent and 2.9 percent in 2012. That compares with its forecast in January, when it estimated growth this year between 2.2 percent and 2.7 percent.

    Yahoo finance April 25,2012


    April 28, 2012 at 5:30 p.m.

  • Here's a good read with examples and everything. Maybe some of you will understand a little more about what all of the hoopla is all about.

    April 28, 2012 at 5:25 p.m.

  • legion,

    You can make an appt. at the SS office. The last time I was there, it wasn't too crowded and 3 windows were open, but if you have someone that cannot wait long, just make an appt. and they have to have someone there at that time to take you in.
    That's what we're going to do when my husband applies for SS.

    April 28, 2012 at 5:08 p.m.

  • It is a pain to get a replacement SS card, especially if the person was born out of state. Seems the local SS office will take a original birth certificate but they have to contact the other state to verify it is original before issuing a replacement card. In some cases up to 3 months. My mom needed a replacement SS card to renew her DL two years ago because of a change in state law or DPS policy, even though she collects SS

    And don't even get me started about the speed of service and efficiency of the local SS office employees, I don't ever won't to over hear Five of then yakking about where they went for lunch when only one window is open! lol. Compared to the local SS office, the local DPS office is a 1000 time better, although that isn't saying much.

    April 28, 2012 at 4:36 p.m.

  • Do you mean to tell me students or whoever can't supply the last four digits of their social security number....that would be discriminatory? LOL!

    And oh yeah, the economy is in great shape, look at these GDP forecasts for this I'm not LOL at this it really makes me sick and it should be a concern even for you.

    April 28, 2012 at 4:34 p.m.

  • "Texas' voter ID law - Senate Bill 14 - "cherry picks" acceptable ID forms, which includes passports and concealed handgun licenses, but not state-issued ID cards for university students or state employees, said Wendy Weiser, director of the democracy program at the Brennan Center for Justice."

    Supporters of the voter ID bill say the measure is needed to make sure ineligible people do not cast ballots in Texas elections.

    Nearly 20 states have adopted some form of Voter ID law, Weiser said.

    This issue is not a diversion. ,people can read the economic data and distinguish between the two, especially in Texas

    "Texas’ 7 percent unemployment rate for March is significantly below the 8.2 percent rate for the nation, he added.
    "There are still significant risk factors to watch out for, including very low natural gas prices which are weighing on drilling activity for natural gas, but I expect the Texas economy to remain strong in 2012,” Dye said in the bank’s April 24 statement.

    To believe anything else is to say the acceptable forms of ID on our registration cards is bogus,so is the investigation by the justice dept.,media is lying because it's just about the economy.

    Yeah,NYT is

    April 28, 2012 at 3:31 p.m.

  • This whole voter ID debate is a red herring to deflect voter's attention from the precarious state of our economy: This is how hard it is to get to vote in Texas under the new law – oh the suffering it will cause, I need a tissue….really! Oh and please note an expired DL is OK, yeah you can use it to vote.....sob oh the humanity!

    “All voters who registered to vote in Texas must provide a Texas driver's license number or personal identification number issued by the Texas Department of Public Safety or the last four digits of your social security number. If you have not been issued any of these numbers, then you must state that fact on the application by checking the designated box.

    A voter who has not been issued a driver’s license or social security number may register to vote, but such voter must submit proof of identification when presenting himself/herself for voting or with his/her mail-in ballots, if voting by mail. These voters’ names are flagged on the official voter registration list with the annotation of “ID.” The “ID” notation instructs the poll worker to request a proper form of identification from these voters when they present themselves for voting. Acceptable identification includes:

    a driver's license or personal identification card issued to the person by the Department of Public Safety or a similar document issued to the person by an agency of another state, regardless of whether the license or card has expired;

    a form of identification containing the person's photograph that establishes the person's identity;

    a birth certificate or other document confirming birth that is admissible in a court of law and establishes the person's identity;

    United States citizenship papers issued to the person;

    a United States passport issued to the person;

    an official mail addressed to the person by name from a governmental entity;
    a copy of a current utility bill, bank statement, government check, paycheck, or other government document that shows the name and address of the voter; or

    any other form of identification prescribed by the Secretary of State. “

    April 28, 2012 at 1:49 p.m.

  • I've written about this before. My mom had a DL, which expired. "I" took her to the dmv to get a Texas ID card in place of the DL, since she was no longer able to drive, and btw, it wasn't free. She was able to use the expired DL for her "proof of citizenship.
    I'm not talking about her. I'm talking about those who don't have a DL or passport or do not know how to get a certified copy of their bc. Many seniors do not have access to their records so easily. Many of them do not have anyone to help them obtain it, no one to drive them around, or make the calls necessary to track things down. Try to remember what it was like "back then" for many people. Recordkeeping was not how it is today and people moved around a lot.

    April 28, 2012 at 12:55 p.m.

  • In the Unites States it is against the law to charge a fee or tax to allow a citizen the right to vote just as it is to "buy" votes. Jim Crow laws were struck down decades ago and we should all stand up for the right to vote.

    Those folks so intent on this travesty would go ballistic is the DNC would grater up every unregistered legal voter and pay the $16 fee if the voter will vote for their candidate.

    April 28, 2012 at 12:28 p.m.

  • Why now is my question and anybody can get a fake ID . I think we should finger print every voter

    April 28, 2012 at 12:05 p.m.

  • Born,
    you can go right down to which ever county you live and get a copy of your BC, or request one through Austin.I want to know, where is grandma's ID card? My mother is 88 yrs young, she has ID/DLand a voter's ID card. Nothings has stopped her from voting,I'm still not buying this bs from democrats...

    April 28, 2012 at 11:42 a.m.

  • It is a "poll tax" but it's also very easy to understand...If the states paid for grandma's fee then the taxpayers would scream about the unneeded expenditures and if it would allow grandma to vote;that would defeat the original purpose.

    April 28, 2012 at 11:36 a.m.

  • Why do people keep blowing off the fee for this "Voters" I.D.? That is nothing less than a Poll Tax. If the GOP wants smaller less intrusive government and taxes reduced why are they insisting on creating a new bureaucracy and insisting on a $16 tax to allow a citizen to vote. I don't know how much voting abuse is going on but there is a massive "VOTERS" abuse being encouraged by the Republican Party..

    April 28, 2012 at 11:25 a.m.

  • butwiser

    I have to admit I still don’t understand your" shock therapy" writing style. I guess it's because I firmly believe that this country is polarized. We like to say that we don't vote straight party but studies prove that to be false. All across this nation the majority of voters vote straight party by a lot. I believe 85% of Victoria County voted republican. It's perfectly acceptable to make group arguments.

    I know that stats bore people so let me give you a couple of folksy examples but first some background.

    1. Voter ID was never a grassroots effort; it was contrived across nation by controlling GOP legislators and governors.
    2. If you think "contrived " is too harsh, others can read a new book titled " Do not Ask What Good We Do" by Robert Draper...The author said as President Obama and Michelle Obama were dancing at their inaugural ball, key members of the GOP, Cantor, Paul Ryan, GOP pollster Frank Luntz and others were in a room adjacent to the White House plotting a strategy of "No" and a coordinated effort to supplant the president before he can ever get started.
    3. Vet43 mentioned the new $16 fee but grandma now has to find her birth certificate, perhaps a new fee, bus money to and from... The people I'm talking about- use every penny of their yearly $8000 spending money, so yes it's an extra burden on them and would likely deter them from voting.
    4. You and I could come up with alternative methods but that's a waste of time; the rules are already stipulated and are on back of our registration cards.

    Let's call you Congressman butwiser and I'll take Congressman Mike.

    You come into my office asking me for my vote but you don't really need it because you have overwhelming numbers to pass anything you want. You tell me you want to pass a voter ID law. I say OK but then I asked you if we had a voter fraud problem. You tell me no but it's for the future. You already knew that I might listen to you because I have already advocated for National ID card and it would look good if some Dems voted for it.. I say fine but it might take a couple years to get everyone to comply. You then tell me no, it's for this election..... I'm a democrat; I know I don't have any legislative power, so I file a grievance with the Atty. General of the United States.... The justice department looks at voter fraud and voter suppression. The votes have been cast and now it's in the hands of the court.

    Like as said, there has been about five blogs, a couple of letters- to- the editor, some columnist posts where people have made their viewpoints know in our forum.

    I look at it this way: a man that wants to buy boat will not convince his wife that all the fish he will catch will pay for the boat. Bottom line this issue is political and I will always think that until I see some substantiated evidence to prove otherwise.

    April 28, 2012 at 11:09 a.m.

  • itisi,

    Speaking from experience with my mom. Of course seniors have a SS card if they are on SS or Medicaid, but some of them don't know where the actual "physical" card is. To find my mom's after my dad died, we had to literally tear apart a 3000 sq. ft. house. She didn't have any idea where it was. I guess it had happened before because we actually found severl cards for her, so my dad must have applied for duplicates several times.
    People move, things get misplaced, etc. The older you get, the worse that problem gets, expecially if the husband took care of everything like that for them.

    April 28, 2012 at 9:41 a.m.

  • SWWW,
    I do agree with you about the SS card, I received mine around that same time frame. However I was talking in the 21st century. I can’t get these dems to explain why grandma doesn’t have an ID card, because by golly we do live in the 21st century, you know BO said conservatives think the earth is flat, well it’s quite the opposite.

    April 28, 2012 at 8:02 a.m.

  • Writein, You never cease to amaze me. Can you read? Can you understand English? I wrote "This is not saying that all people that vote as a democrat meet the above conditions" to make sure people that vote democrat did not think I was lumping them in the listed groups. And you are the one that thought you were being called an idiot. The funny thing is I already knew it would be you that would respond. I never called you an idiot.

    The whole reason for writing the letter the way I did was to "shock" people into realizing how stupid the supplied group arguments are. The groups I mentioned vote democrat, republican, and independent. But when an argument for voter ID is raised, these groups are solid democrat and they are going to be stripped of their right to vote because people in these groups cannot possibly be able to produce an ID. Again, the letter was written to get the point across as to how stupid the arguments really are. Mike, I am surprised you did not pick up on what I was doing. You are intelligent and express yourself very well.

    I learned this writing method in my college years. I forget some people are not familiar with this form of writing. And by no means do I place myself as being more intelligent than any other person that responds in these discussions. I didn't bring up education level, I was asked in a nasty manner to list my education.

    Did anybody understand what I was doing when I wrote the letter? Oh, yeah, about the crickets, I have to work for a living.

    April 27, 2012 at 11:22 p.m.

  • It's a small world.....from Wikipedia

    "One key turning point against the Clinton plan (Hiliary Care) was a televised town hall meeting in April 1994. During the event, President Clinton was challenged by businessman Herman Cain on the resulting effects on small businesses."

    April 27, 2012 at 8:15 p.m.

  • How right you are Legion

    The other night I was reading how LBJ was cussing the southern conservative democrats and started making deals with the northeastern republican  liberals to get civil rights passed....He found they were easier to work with and gave them all the pats on the back and praised them at news conferences but he got his legislation

    LBJ was a  politician's ...politician ....but I wouldn't buy a used car from him...:-)

    They all had their quirks.

    April 27, 2012 at 8:05 p.m.

  • I hear crickets. I guess someone who proclaims his two times 4.0 “intelligence” won’t share his intellect on important issues with ideas and solutions?

    Mr. J. Williams

    April 27, 2012 at 7:33 p.m.

  • I know Mike, it seems the two major political partys have switched sides on issues. If the Newt wouldn't have been speaker of the House, what was called Hilliary care would probably be the law of the land now.

    April 27, 2012 at 7:13 p.m.

  • Idtisi...I have a Social Security Card but I didn't get it until I was a junior in high school. It WASN'T issued at birth. And, MY card plainly states that it is NOT to be used for identification. I understand new cards don't say that.

    April 27, 2012 at 6:41 p.m.

  • That's true Legion and he also crafted a health care plan and had entertained a good fix for Medicare but those plans would been rejected by today's GOP...Then Watergate came along and those ideas went out the window....Did you ever read about his strange behavings after Watergate?He would get drunk and talk to the pictures of past presidents...:-) To be fair,I'm sure he was under a lot pressure.

    Have a good one

    April 27, 2012 at 6:36 p.m.

  • Butwiser.

    You said that you have two degrees with 4.0’s and you refer to people who vote for one way as idiots. You talk about intelligence levels of people. Here is the question for you, ITISI, David Webb, DEBUNKER, BIGHORN, and others.

    1) What and where is your solution on Education?

    2) What and where is your solution on Illegal Immigration?

    3) What and where is your solution on Middle East Affairs?

    4) What and where is your solution on America’s Energy policy?

    5) What and where is your solution on America’sfailing economy?

    Where are they, Butwiser? You said you are smarter than anyone else on here including me. Let’s hear it!!!

    Mr. J. Williams

    April 27, 2012 at 6:23 p.m.

  • Tricky Dickie always gets a bad name, the good things he did are always overlooked.

    "Although Nixon initially escalated the war in Vietnam, he subsequently ended US involvement in 1973. Nixon's visit to the People's Republic of China in 1972 opened diplomatic relations between the two nations, and he initiated détente and the Anti-Ballistic Missile Treaty with the Soviet Union the same year. Domestically, his administration generally embraced policies that transferred power from Washington to the states. Among other things, he initiated wars on cancer and drugs, imposed wage and price controls, enforced desegregation of Southern schools and established the Environmental Protection Agency. Though he presided over Apollo 11, he scaled back manned space exploration. He was reelected by a landslide in 1972."

    April 27, 2012 at 5:55 p.m.

  • vet, you forgot about Bush II, and Reagan

    April 27, 2012 at 5:21 p.m.

  • Don't forget Bush/Cheney ,one went out with 32 % approval and his mate ~15%...Together they attacked a country that had nothing to do with 911.

    Vote Romney--Of his 22 foreign policy advisers,17 served for the Bush administration...They'll just have to change the letters from a Q to an N and preemptive war will again be the foreign policy..That's smarts...NO Child Left Behind..How did that go over?

    April 27, 2012 at 5:19 p.m.

  • Thank goodness the GOP has developed a race of superior beings. The same ones that elected Nixon and Agnew. Now there is an I.Q. test that is hard to beat.

    April 27, 2012 at 5:07 p.m.

  • butwiser, I apologize for stealing this. I liked it so much I felt it needed to be at the top of this blog a little longer.

    From all of this I have determined that if a person is mentally incapable of taking care of themselves due to age, or are poor, or stupid, totally incompetent, a minority, a student, never drove a car, can't produce any records, they are going to vote as a democrat. This is not saying that all people that vote as a democrat meet the above conditions. I have been told that the democrat base is increasing. I believe that. Look at the intelligence level being produced by our schools today. The math a science rating being discussed on the news today showed the US as near 20th place. We are producing a nation of idiots and idiots vote for the democrat.

    April 27, 2012 at 4:08 p.m.

  • I repeat. It is a Poll Tax.

    April 27, 2012 at 2:54 p.m.

  • Where in the world is the proof that grandma doesn’t have an ID card… LOL! Dang let me write you another crying in your beer song… Titled: “Grandma can’t vote”

    April 27, 2012 at 2:11 p.m.

  • budwiser

    For a person who claims to have two college degrees carrying a 4.0 GPA in each; your posts make me a disbeliever. Nice touch, I stood up and saluted and then sang a chorus of "Yankee Doodle Dandy" when you posted “I am not democrat or republican. I vote the way I think puts the country first."...OK,enough about you and let's go on to your posts,BTW,your comment history is telling, so why don't you embrace it, instead of skirting the issue with superficial posts....You have erased a lot of your comments but if you want a copy..:-)

    This voter ID issue is a national one and republican governors (in a coordinated effort) have made it hard are to vote for people who usually vote for the democratic ticket. You would think a man with 2 college degrees and a 4.0 DP would have read about the different tactics they have used.

    For the record, several years ago I wrote a blog about Dick Durbin's bill calling for a National ID card but the conservatives opposed it in Washington and on my blog because of big brother issues. I’m for a tamper proof National ID card but I know it can't be put into force right away; these things take time and can't be done for political expediency.

    You continue to stereotype democratic voters but the people you are denigrating don't even vote. Only 17% of the younger voter (18-29 years old) actually votes. The people the democrats are concerned with is that poor grandma in the Appalachians or the barrios of San Antonio who has voted all her life but now it will be more difficult to do so. Why? There hasn't been an epidemic of voter fraud and those grandmothers and grandfathers won't be seen at the bus station with the latest iPhone and blue tooth headset in their ear. Pundits have said that up to 5-6 million voters will be disenfranchised this year and up to 600,000 in Texas..Republicans can be proud. I'm proud that the democrats are sticking up for their constituents. I want to encourage more to vote not make it harder for them.

    For the first time ever, the Wisconsin GOP legislators made it more difficult for out -of- state college students to vote because they will no longer accept their college picture ID as proof of identification.

    Yes the democrat base is increasing, for one the GOP is alienating women, minorities, and the poor with their policies and rhetoric. Their strategy of “taking away from the poor to make them richer and giving tax cuts to the rich to make them richer is perplex to say the least. Somehow that formula doesn't calculate.

    Really, the intelligence level of democrats, you really want to go there or you trying to say something else?

    April 27, 2012 at 10:33 a.m.

  • This comment was removed by the user.

    April 27, 2012 at 10:01 a.m.

  • This comment was removed by the user.

    April 27, 2012 at 9:52 a.m.

  • SS card? Sure, of course there are no fake SS cards out there, right?


    Again, of course, democrats are not the only ones that have trouble voting without ID, but statistically, the groups that are hurt by this new law are those that historically vote democratic.
    This isn't the only thing being done to deter voting. Some states have changed their early voting rules. There will not be as much time to vote early, closing some places, no Saturday voting, etc. All meant to hurt working people who cannot get off, cannot afford to take off to vote, or do not have transportation during the work week.

    If you look at all the changes in the entirety, it is obvious who is being targeted, and if you cannot see that, you are just unwilling to acknowledge it.

    April 27, 2012 at 8:07 a.m.

  • It is a Republican platform that is underfunding our education system. I have heard many Conservatives take an anti-science stance. The earth is only 6000 years old is a common belief in the GOP.

    The fact is there is a Conservative drive to increase taxes and re-introduce a Poll Tax.

    April 27, 2012 at 7:51 a.m.

  • I think each and every one of us has a social security card that has been issued by the United States Government. This is a required document by the Government if you’re a U.S. citizen, and this document must be obtained as soon as one has proof of Birth. I’m not buying all of these excuses from democrats that grandma cannot afford an ID card or any other person for that matter. You have to have identification in order to move about and or conduct your personal business in the United States… Once again does anyone know someone that does not have an ID card?

    April 27, 2012 at 7:06 a.m.

  • jasonbourne is laughing out loud!

    April 27, 2012 at 6:22 a.m.

  • From all of this I have determined that if a person is mentally incapable of taking care of themselves due to age, or are poor, or stupid, totally incompetent, a minority, a student, never drove a car, can't produce any records, they are going to vote as a democrat. This is not saying that all people that vote as a democrat meet the above conditions. I have been told that the democrat base is increasing. I believe that. Look at the intelligence level being produced by our schools today. The math a science rating being discussed on the news today showed the US as near 20th place. We are producing a nation of idiots and idiots vote for the democrat.

    April 27, 2012 at 5:30 a.m.

  • The first time I voted in the 80's I had my drivers license out along with my voter ID card. Of course I did not need it. It made sense at the time and still does to show a photo ID.
    A person must have some form of identification to conduct many things in their daily lives. If someone doesn't have a photo ID, they must be a hermit and probably will not vote anyhow.
    I agree with lms01 post! The rest of you can bicker until the sun comes up.

    April 27, 2012 at 2:24 a.m.

  • Note: I misspoke earlier regarding the Texas I.D. fee for a disabled Veteran because the fee will be waived, but the fact remains if a non-disabled Veteran wants to vote it will still cost him/her $16.

    April 27, 2012 at 2:13 a.m.

  • butwiser,

    According to the DPS web site the fee for a Texas I.D. is $16 and must be renewed every 6 years. An replacement for a lost I.D. is $6. The fee is waived for a disabled Veteran.

    So in effect this would be a fee or tax required to cast a vote. That is unconstitutional and is the equivalence of a Poll Tax. This paranoia is disenfranchising American citizens that have the right to vote.

    It is no longer 1950 and June Cleaver has left the building and taken the Jim Crow laws with her.

    April 27, 2012 at 2:06 a.m.

  • vet43,

    Most people have some form of ID already in their possession. For those who don't currently have an ID, I understand one can be made at the DPS for $5.00, not $16. But I also understand, ID's required for voting are free if you don't currently have one. The ID can be used for other needs as well. I agree that no one should be charged to vote. I don't see how requiring a photo ID takes away anyone's right to vote. You have to be registered, This is just an additional step to prove you are the individual named on the registration.

    April 26, 2012 at 10:40 p.m.

  • This started out as a thread about voter fraud and it has turned into a campaign to disenfranchise citizens that do not meet some posters high standards. It seemed that most conservatives are opposed to raising taxes but here they are asking people to pay a fee ($16) to cast a vote. Wasn't that what used to be called a "Poll Tax"? If a disabled Veteran shows up with a DD-214 he/she still must pay a tax to receive the right to vote. That just smells bad.

    April 26, 2012 at 9:41 p.m.

  • itisi,

    Not everyone has a drivers license. I knew a few older ladies that never learned to drive. It happens, more so in larger cities that have public transportation, but it does happen.
    And, not everyone uses checks.
    You cannot judge everyone by yourself and what you do and have done.

    April 26, 2012 at 9:12 p.m.

  • Butwiser.
    I don’t know and I don’t care why I was given the hassle. I am not going to into that. I made my case and they quickly corrected it. In those ID Laws, there are parts of it that places limits on registration drives. Most of those drives are in areas that tend to vote Democratic or against the status quo. The League of Women Voters, a nonpartisan group is suing some of the states over this. If you place limitations on voter registration then you are stealing an election. How can a person in rural parts go to vote or registrar to vote when Post Offices are closed down?

    April 26, 2012 at 8:54 p.m.

  • Writein,

    I was giving you a chance to answer my question as to why only democrats are impacted by voter photo ID's. You still haven't answered the three suggested reasons giving in this thread. I then asked you why you were given a hassle when you went to vote with your photo ID and voter registration and why raising hell helped your case. I really wanted to know why you were hassled. I thought that would be something you would want to share. But, you can't even answer that question. You are always yelling at other posters to ANSWER your questions. If fact you demand it, but you can't answer any questions asked of you.

    April 26, 2012 at 8:25 p.m.

  • I don't agree with a blanket exemption for people over 70. I have friends that are in their 80's and still drive (very well I might add) and can run circles around some 30 year olds. I don't have the latest stats, but I know there were some fighting the exemption should be removed. As brought up by Vet43, disabled individuals, people on assignment, either military or private, in other states or other nations need a way to vote. There are special cases. However, I don't like laws or rules that are punched full of holes.

    April 26, 2012 at 8:06 p.m.

  • Itisi.
    Is that a threat? If I would have said that , you and others like Debunker and country Chic would be calling for my head on this forum. And You know it. Have you actually sit down and read the VOTER ID laws? There are number of amendments that call for hindering or limiting Voter Registration drives. As for that threat you made, I honor the 2nd amendment.
    Lets see what excuse you will make this time?

    Mr. J. Williams

    April 26, 2012 at 8:01 p.m.

  • Butwiser.
    Spar me the noise. You said that won’t reply because this isn’t about me, but later in your post you said, “The others haven't answered it either, but I want if from YOU!” MAKE UP YOUR MIND!!!! Which is which? What do you want me to draw you a picture to get a damn clue? As for the “it nothing cost nothing to get an ID”, yes it does. When was the last time you bought an ID?
    Instead of you trying to talk with me, you try to talk pass me and talk to me like I am stupid. Answer was given and you want to play the game. Let me make myself clear rising hell for the right to vote have done me some justice. I did vote, after 15 minutes of B.S. !!!! I come in with my driver license and my vote regsitation card then I SHOULD HAVE NO DAMN PROBLEM VOTING!!! I DESERVED SOME DAMN RESPECT!!!!


    2) The VOTER ID LAWS hinder Registration DRIVES! LOOK IT UP!!! It doesn’t take a rocket scientist to figure it out. Maybe you use your internet and research the league of women voters, Rock the Vote org, and other third party organizations. They filed complaints.

    Mr. Williams

    April 26, 2012 at 7:56 p.m.

  • Does anyone know of anyone that does not have an ID other than a possibly illegal alien? My point here is, why is it so dang difficult to reach in your pocket book or wallet and pull out your voter ID card along with some type of ID. What in the heck is the dang issue with democrats? If you go write a check at H-E-B you will need your dang driver’s license. What do you dems want another 1946 Battle of Athens Tennessee, because if this crap continues folks will rise up... I'm just saying...

    April 26, 2012 at 7:43 p.m.

  • Born2bme

    Say that again? People over 70 are not required to show ID. I smell something fishy here. I guess Butwiser won't read that.

    April 26, 2012 at 7:33 p.m.

  • I just read where folks over 70 are exempt from the photo ID law. Why?

    April 26, 2012 at 7:05 p.m.

  • How is it validated without proper photo ID, not that it would matter without visually seeing both at the same time, and why is there one set of rules one way and a different set of rules another way?

    April 26, 2012 at 7:02 p.m.

  • Writein,

    I am not going to keep on replying to you because I don't want to make this discussion about you. It was about keeping our vote safe. You say you were denied the opportunity to vote when you presented your voter registration and photo ID. Why? And why did raising hell make a difference? No one has answered my question as to why ID would have an impact on this president other than to say seniors, students, and minorities. One gave their reason for seniors being an issue. The other two issues have never been addressed. Students have to register for college. They must present the same documents necessary to obtain a valid ID card. Minorities, how so? Are they not equal to other people? Other people can get the ID. That implies inequality and that is racist. And don't bring up the poor line. It costs nothing for an ID card. Have you ever noticed that these poor people have cell phones and not just the cheap ones? You have not answered the question I asked. The others haven't answered it either, but I want if from YOU! You say you have all the answers and everybody else is wrong or a liar, so give us YOUR answer. And don't spin like you did in your last post. You went on and on and never answered the question, but you thought you did.

    April 26, 2012 at 6:56 p.m.

  • then your vote is thrown out if not properly validated (except for military and people working out of country)

    April 26, 2012 at 5:38 p.m.

  • roberttx,

    Take one good guess as to why voter ID doesn't have to be shown for absentee voting?
    My guess is that those voters are either more republican, and/or they are not the groups being targeted.

    April 26, 2012 at 5:36 p.m.

  • why fight for voter id at the poll if you don't have any voter id on absentee ballots ?

    either validate voters or don't validate voters

    April 26, 2012 at 4:55 p.m.

  • Butwiser.

    The answer was already given to you. Not just from me, but from Born2bme, Mike and Vet43. Here is one more time, I am going to answer you. You better take or leave it. I have been voting since 2000. I voted in Washington, Walker, and my home county with Voter ID. If there is voterID going on now, why need the law? The law whether you like it or not hinders certian people from voting. How most of those people don't drive, own a stable place, or can't walk to have an ID. Before you open your mouth and talk about going to the library and getting one. GUESS WHAT, NOT ALL LIBRARIES DOES IT!!!!!! NOT EVERYONE IS GOING TO PAY 15 d@mn dollars for an ID, when THEY need to EAT!!!! DONT YOU TRY WITH the poor shouldn't vote BS!!
    Back on primary day 2008, I came in with my ID and voter Reg. card. I was denied to vote, BUT AFTER RASING HELL , THEY FINALLY ALLOW ME TO VOTE!!!! I willl not allow that to happen to me or anyone else AGAIN. I wish I can tell you in person!!!!!!!

    Don't make me go on your comment history and dig up offensive comments you made!!

    Mr. J. Williams

    April 26, 2012 at 4:40 p.m.

  • roberttx,

    You have just moved our nation back 100 years. And that is wrong.

    April 26, 2012 at 3:49 p.m.

  • vet43, yes they should get to the poll in person. it's the only way to cut out the absentee voter fraud. id be fine for extending the absentee ballots to anyone at an overseas address and military.

    it's people requesting the ballots in county that's the problem. you have no idea who's requesting that ballot, none, zero, zilch. if you require an ID to vote in person how can justify sending a ballot without an validation on who requested it and such ?

    in local races 100 votes is enough to swing an election. 100 absentee votes is nothing for a veteran vote wrangler.

    if the county can't validate who is requesting that absentee ballot, they shouldn't send it out.

    April 26, 2012 at 2:26 p.m.

  • Writein,

    First, you never answered my question as to how photo ID would cost this president the election. You seemed to imply this. Second, you are the one always bringing race into the discussion. I think others will agree with me on that one. If the shoe fits, wear it. Third, I asked a question, Are you actually saying that the Democrat machine cannot win without fraud? That is what your comment sounded like and that is why I asked you to clarify. Fourth, I am not ashamed of any comment I have made. I stand by them like a MAN! You haven't been able to prove me wrong. If you don't have a response, you write "You lie" and then say "There I said it". Fifth, you have the mindset. You say you are democrat and that you will always vote democrat. I am not democrat or republican. I vote the way I think puts the country first. As for this election, I am voting for who I think will do the least damage because I don't like either candidate. I found agreement with almost every comment in this discussion except yours. Now I have had my say. I still want you to answer why photo ID's will hurt the Democrats or cause this president to loose the election. Come on, we are all waiting

    April 26, 2012 at 2:09 p.m.

  • Butwiser.

    You need to buy a clue. Every thing was laid out for you, but you rather play games. It seems you have no shame. First I am called a racist by you and now I favored fruad. There are some things you wont admit because it goes against your mindset.

    Mr. J. Williams

    April 26, 2012 at 12:45 p.m.

  • roberttx,

    So you feel that home-bound citizens should not have the right to vote? What about Texas citizens that are on extended employment out side of the state, or country, are not allowed to cast their vote. There are many reasons getting to the polling place could be an issue but those taxpaying citizens have a voice and deserve to be heard.

    April 26, 2012 at 10:23 a.m.

  • No problem with a state photo ID if they have no fee attached. I have a big problem paying a tax or toll to vote. Any one remember the famous "Poll Tax"?

    April 26, 2012 at 9:55 a.m.

  • the fraud isnt in election day voting, it's in absentee ballots. south texas has mastered the art of absentee ballot fraud and it is a true art.

    absentee ballots should be limited to military only

    April 26, 2012 at 9:52 a.m.

  • Many seniors, who do not drive or haven't driven in years, have a hard time coming up with Primary identification. They also have a hard time finding their original BC or even know where to find a certified copy.
    All of this takes time and older folks are not in a position to find these things themselves, nor do they have anyone that can help. If you've never dealt with a senior citizen, then you don't know how they think about having to ask for help with something like this. They would rather just not vote than go through all the trouble.
    I cannot speak for the difficulties that minorities have of locating important documents, so cannot comment on specifics. Same with students.

    April 26, 2012 at 9:51 a.m.

  • cont....

    Supporting Identification:
    These items consist of other records or documents that aid examining personnel in establishing the identity of the applicant. The following items are not all inclusive. The examining or supervisory personnel may determine that an unlisted document meets the department's needs in establishing identity.

    1. school records;

    2. insurance policy (at least two years old);

    3. vehicle title;

    4. military records;

    5. unexpired military dependant identification card;

    6. original or certified copy of marriage license or divorce decree;

    7. voter registration card;

    8. Social Security card;

    9. pilot's license;

    10. concealed handgun license;

    11. Texas driver license temporary receipt;

    12. expired driver license or identification certificate issued by another state, territory, District of Columbia , or Canadian province that is within two years of the expiration date.

    13. a foreign passport (with or without a United States Visa); or

    14. a consular document issued by a state or national government.

    April 26, 2012 at 9:44 a.m.

  • Here is what's needed for application for photo ID in Texas

    DPS Texas Identification Requirements for an Identification Card
    The State issued identification certificates (I.D. Card) are the nationally accepted form of identification and both are used daily to establish identity at airports, banks, when writing checks, voting, or applying for governmental aid. Due to their extensive use as a person's primary source of identity the department has the responsibility to correctly determine an applicant's identity.

    All original applicants for an identification certificate must present proof of identity satisfactory to the department. (All applicants for a driver license must also provide proof of their social security number). All documents must be verifiable by the source that issued the document.

    There are three categories of documents that may be presented to establish proof of identity. Every original applicant must present: one piece of primary identification; or one piece of secondary identification plus two pieces of support identification; or two pieces of secondary identification.

    Primary Identification:
    These items are complete within themselves and require no supporting instruments: These documents must contain the applicant's complete name and full date of birth.

    1. Texas driver license (DL) or identification certificate (ID) with photograph within two years after the expiration date.

    2. Unexpired United States Passport;

    3. United States citizenship (naturalization) certificate with identifiable photograph;

    4. Unexpired United States Immigration and Naturalization Service document with verified date and identifiable photograph;

    5. Unexpired United States military ID card for active duty, reserve or retired personnel with identifiable photograph.

    Secondary Identification:
    These items are recorded governmental documents ( United States , one of the fifty states, a United States territory, District of Columbia , or Canadian province).

    1. Original or certified copy of a birth certificate issued by the appropriate State Bureau of Vital Statistics or equivalent agency.

    2. Original or certified copy of United States Department of State Certification of Birth (issued to United States citizens born abroad) or;

    3. Unexpired photo DL or photo ID issued by another ( United States ) state, US territory, the District of Columbia , or Canadian province;

    4. Original or certified copy of court order with name and date of birth or;

    5. for applicants born before 1961, the following items would be acceptable in the category:

    a) original or certified copy of Form DD-214;

    b) original or certified copy of other state or federal governmental record that states name and date of birth (such as United States records or Social Security records).


    April 26, 2012 at 9:43 a.m.

  • butwiser,

    It hurts the blocs that turned out in great numbers for President Obama at the last election. Namely, students, seniors, and minorities. Those are the ones that have the greatest difficulties coming up with the documentation needed to apply for a photo ID, in such a short amount of time.
    Why do you think it is such a pressing thing "right now"?

    April 26, 2012 at 9:29 a.m.

  • As far as I'm concerned, if a person is too lazy, unmotivated or stupid to get a photo ID...they shouldn't be voting. There simply is no logical or rational reason not to require photo identification to vote.

    April 26, 2012 at 8:53 a.m.

  • OK, from the comments I have determined that photo ID's can't be implemented while a Democrat is in office because it might cause them to loose the election. Photo ID's can't be implemented while a Republican is in office because it will prevent a Democrat win. So from this we can gather that the Democrats are the ones who will suffer from photo ID's. Which would imply that Democrats use voter fraud to win elections. What else could it be if only the Democrats will be affected?

    April 26, 2012 at 8:26 a.m.

  • Voter ID took off after the 2000 election Florida fiasco and again after the 2008 election with the revelations about ACORN/SEIU and their fraudulent voter registration activities. Voter ID laws have been around since 1999 according to Wikipedia so it's not just because of the 2012 election:

    "In 1999, Virginia Governor Jim Gilmore (R) attempted to start a pilot program that required voters to show IDs at the polls. His initiative was blocked by Democrats and the NAACP, and was stopped by court order.[2] His administration had spent and mailed $275,000 worth of free voter ID cards to residents in Arlington and Fairfax counties.[3][4][5] In the aftermath of the 2000 election, where George W. Bush narrowly won Florida by 537 votes, the American public and lawmakers became more receptive to measures against voter fraud. In 2002, President Bush signed the Help America Vote Act into law, which required all first-time voters in federal elections to show photo or non-photo ID upon either registration or arrival at the polling place.

    In 2004, Arizona passed a law requiring voters to bring a state-issued photo ID to the polling place. Similar proposals were discussed in various other states and were passed in some cases. In several states a person's citizenship status is noted on their photo ID.

    Indiana passed a law in 2005 requiring a photo ID be shown by all voters before casting ballots.[9] Civil rights groups in Indiana launched a lawsuit that reached the Supreme Court, Crawford v. Marion County Election Board. The Court ruled that the law was constitutional, paving the way for expanded laws in other states......and as of September 2011, 30 U.S. states require some form of photo or non-photo identification. The identification required to submit a ballot differs by state law, and may differ by de facto voting procedures."

    April 26, 2012 at 6:29 a.m.

  • Butwiser.

    Read Born2bme's comments

    April 26, 2012 at 2:55 a.m.

  • I don't understand why this would hurt the Democrat party's chances of winning the office. I don't understand why it would not help keep fraud out of both parties. The only way I can see how it would hurt the Democrats is if they intend to use fraud as a method of increasing the chances of a win in November. Why would they not have the same chance with voter ID as they do without? As I am always told, ANSWER THE QUESTION. Why would it change their chances of a win?

    April 26, 2012 at 12:47 a.m.

  • If anyone thinks that fraud is just on one side, they are sadly mistaken. No one is against Voter ID laws. It's just the timing (or lack of) this year. It's directly aimed at this upcoming election. That's why there was never a peep heard about it as long as there was a republican in office.

    April 26, 2012 at 12:28 a.m.

  • Butwiser.

    Did I just laid out my reasons why? Texas is turning purple, Barack Obama is President, and Rick Perry and other state wide GOP'er are increasing getting flak. There is no Democratic machine in Texas. You should be ashamed for suggesting I support election fraud.

    April 26, 2012 at 12:03 a.m.

  • Writein

    Why do you think it is fishy now? Anything that would attempt to stop fraud on either side should be a good thing. Why do you think it would hurt the Democrats? Are you actually saying that the Democrat machine cannot win without fraud?

    April 25, 2012 at 11:48 p.m.

  • Butwiser.

    Why because I don't like and trust those who argue for it. I have many reasons why.This lets do it now is fishy. Those who back this are the same ones who back Florida in 2000, the banning of college student in 2004 in OHIO and the Waller County incident.

    As for Coke Stevenson, I glad he lost, cheated or not, joking about lynching people in East Texas.Who would have think he would do in the Senate?

    South Texas is Democratic andTexas is turning purple that why some people are scared of.

    Mr. J. Williams

    April 25, 2012 at 11:16 p.m.

  • Why start the voter ID program now? Why not? You have to start sometime. Yes, it should have been done decades ago. It might have prevented some of the sited cases from happening. I since the desire for a specific response, but I am not going there. The only reason for starting now is an election is coming up and we want to make sure the election is valid no matter who wins. If our elections can be changed by fraud, "we the people" no longer have any power in our vote.

    April 25, 2012 at 9:23 p.m.

  • Writein..."What about the cheating of elections by racist Dixiecrat Coke Stevensons? By the way, No man is an island so why try to be one, Waywardwind?"

    What about the Dixiecrat cheating? Johnson won so I guess he cheated better than Stevenson. What's the matter, J? Wouldn't you like to see an honest election; one in which you could trust the outcome? I know I would.

    At the risk of setting you off again, I don't know what that thing about an island and trying to be one means. It went right on by and didn't even say "Hi." Perhaps you just wanted to see if you could confuse me even when you spell everything correctly. You succeeded.

    April 25, 2012 at 7:54 p.m.

  • Well, J, Johnson BEAT Stevenson so I guess Johnson cheated better. What's the matter, J? Wouldn't you like to see an HONEST election for a change; one in which you could trust the outcome? I know I would.

    April 25, 2012 at 7:43 p.m.

  • Waywardwind.

    What about the cheating of elections by racist Dixiecrat Coke Stevensons? By the way, No man is an island so why try to be one, Waywardwind?

    April 25, 2012 at 7:34 p.m.

  • You're absolutely right, J. The voter ID laws should have been in effect for decades. You know, back when Landslide Lyndon Johnson was getting elected when a week after the election, 203 votes turned up in a single box in the town of Alice and 202 were for Johnson. Strangely, they all voted at the last minute AND in alphabetical order. Don't forget the Duke of Duval was running a political machine in Duval and Jim Wells countys that could deliver large numbers of legal AND illegal votes. Wait a minute. Those were Democrats who were on the receiving end of those illegal votes so I guess that makes it okay. As for "why now?" How about "Better late than never."

    April 25, 2012 at 7:09 p.m.

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    April 25, 2012 at 6:55 p.m.

  • Gosh writein how do you keep up with all these questions that have no answers.

    I can't even remember what the hot topics were yesterday.

    April 25, 2012 at 6:47 p.m.

  • Butwiser.

    The last time this topic was bought up, you didn't answer my question. It seems people don't want to answer because it goes against their beliefs or talking points. ONE MORE TIME BUTWISER, why hadn't this issue bought up five or ten years ago? Second question why hadn't any of yall mention some sec of states blocking college students from voting? The Waller county incident was on to remember.

    Mr. J. Williams

    April 25, 2012 at 6:44 p.m.

  • Waywardwind.

    I hazard a guess that someone enbolden you to talk smack to me. I know how and why Slick Rick won so don't attempt to talk to me like I'm stupid. The people who been in power wanted ID laws. So the question is why NOW? Why not years ago, when Bush, Perry, and GOP rein at their height Oh oh..could it be because Texas is turning purple in the next few election cycles? I can hang my hat on that.

    Now without your smack, can you answer that?


    April 25, 2012 at 6:31 p.m.

  • Older "butwiser",

    Bravo! Bravo!

    April 25, 2012 at 6:28 p.m.

  • Actually I thought Observer's comment was on target, although it should not have contained the Obama slur. There is NO valid reason why a voter cannot have a photo ID. This has already been discussed. The ID law has provisions for disabled individuals, elderly and such. People say senior citizens can't get an ID. I haven't seen a valid reason why. People say it is not fair to minorities. I haven't seen a valid reason why. The only ones I see as having a problem are illegal residents. Remember, illegals come in all races so this is not race specific. This is not a Republican or Democrat issue. It is a voter issue. It is to insure that fraud is not committed by voting more than once, voting as someone else, or voting by a non citizen of this country. Protecting our right to vote should not upset anyone except those who intend to use fraud of some type.

    April 25, 2012 at 6:24 p.m.

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    April 25, 2012 at 6:21 p.m.

  • Writein...why did Perry win his elections? Well, let's see.....I'm thinkin' he got more votes than his opponent. Yeah, that could be it. Were all the votes that were cast legal? I don't know. There was no requirement for people to present an ID prior to voting.

    April 25, 2012 at 6:01 p.m.

  • This comment was removed by the user.

    April 25, 2012 at 5:42 p.m.

  • Observer.

    Since you love to call people names let me ask you this. If Voter ID was so needed, then how come Ricky Dink Perry won 3 times?

    Come on and answer the questions.

    Mr. J. Williams

    April 25, 2012 at 5:07 p.m.

  • Given the history of this issue, there is only one plausible reason why the ObaMao administration is opposing these laws -- they see the illegal votes going to him. This issue arose with an Indiana law passed in 2005. It was litigated, appealed and reached the Supreme Court in 2008. The Court's verdict in Crawford v. Marion County Election Board -- 553 U.S. 181 (2008) -- was that the law was perfectly constitutional. All subsequent attempts to oppose voter ID laws fly in the face of this Supreme Court decision. The U.S. Justice Department's disapproval of these laws in Texas and other states will clearly lose in the courts, based on the Supreme Court ruling. Their only reason for opposing voter ID has to be that they want to garner as many illegal votes as possible in the upcoming Presidential election, knowing that, in the long run, they will lose. But they hope to delay that loss until after the election.

    April 25, 2012 at 1:58 p.m.