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IMO, there would not be as much protesting of any health care bill if the employer fines and fines for individuals who do not "participate" where not included. In other words making health insurance MANDATORY for each and every American.
The "they will kill granny" thing, is in actuality a family and personal matter.
With the advances in continuing life that have been made these days it comes down to after a stroke or Alzheimer afflicts a person, which would the afflicted person prefer, to live for maybe years in a nursing home without any understanding of where they are and to not be able to even care for there own most basic needs, hygiene, feeding themselves ect. or to, and I know it is harsh, to be let go?
A living will and a DNR directive helps in those cases but not always.
My aunt is in that situation, after a stroke she is in a nursing home, does not recognize family members and basically is just there, 5 years after the stroke. It is truly sad, she would not want to be in that situation if she had a say in the matter by the way she lived her life.
My biggest opposition to your blog is that you make the assumption that ALL the protesters are right-wing conservatives. I could be wrong, but I don't believe, you really believe only right-wing conservatives oppose higher taxes, lower unemployment rates, and the current House Healthcare Plan.
Nonsense! MLK would applaud civil disobedience to preserve liberties. I can't vouch for everyone that's participating in these "mobs" nationwide. I can only vouch for my ilk and their motivations. I'm repulsed that FoxNews has influenced some of these events because of their sordid past and likely nefarious agenda. I don't get my marching orders from those snakes. My calling comes from an understanding of my rights and how the government continually supplants our rights and those of our decedents.
I think MLK would be sickened by what the government has become. He'd especially puke at the sight of our bloated welfare system that has snared generations into dependence.
Got any other emotional cards to pull?
What are "birthers?" Do you mean "home birthers?" Are they right-winged? I always thought they were more crunchy and organic.
ArewilYou might be right but as President Nixon was asked “how do you measure that?”
MikeThis Public Option Healthcare Plan has awakened the Silent Majority.
Classy & articulate, as always, Mike.
Yeah, you're right, there's really no need to address the (de)merits of my comment. Cracking a joke will suffice. I gladly accept your silence as your not having the courage and/or mental wherewithal to form a rebuttal.
Thanks for being an unoriginal product of entrenched establishment group-think. Unfortunately, they didn't break the mold when they squeezed you out of the proverbial Playdough factory.
Thanks BSspotter,I needed a nap.:-)
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Now wait a minute, you right wingers need to get your labels straight, I cannot be a socialist and a fascist. ;-) Social Democrats were, in fact, the main opponents of the rise of Nazi's power in Weimar Germany; Nazi Germany and Socialist Russia were at each other's throats in World War II.
Yesterday ,Chris Matthew was going over the Rush Limbaugh monologue as he called the Obama Administration and the democrats' Nazis and went on to give the reasons why.
The Nazis loved the environment…lol… Don’t we all?NAZI Germany was anti smoking…. I’ve could have sworn I have seen many NAZI officers dragging on a cigarette.
NAZI Germany hated big business… I can name many corporations that supported the initial NAZI party.It was so ludicrous that even Pat Buchanan couldn’t keep from snickering and laughing, Pat had to drink a cup of water to keep from showing up Rush. In fact, he had to agree that Rush went overboard.Whenever Democrats, Republicans, conservatives or liberals bring in the word NAZI then their argument becomes useless. This is still America and an argument on how to spend the tax revenues does not make anyone a fascist, socialist or a Nazi.
I will just ask a simple question, are the Democrats being bused into the town hall meetings of Republican legislators? Legitimate source please.
The incident in Tampa was predictable; the UFL-CIO warned that they would keep out any protesters that were supported by the healthcare lobbyist.The last two nights MSNBC‘s Rachel Maddow, interviewed the heads of the lobbyist groups that are involved, Max Pappas of Freedom Works and Timothy Phillips of Americans for Prosperity. They’re not denying their involvement… In fact go to their web sites and you will see videos of the disruptions and a map of all the town hall meetings the Democrats are having…… Don’t take my word for it, look it up.
Keep on busing but the groups don’t have to lie, call it an organize effort, instead of a grassroots effort.
I love how the facist refers to american people voicing their opinions at a town hall meeting "right wing thugery". How DARE they think that they have a right to free speech. Freedom of speech is limited to liberals and those who want to fill a jar full of urine, throw a crucifix inside and call it art.
Code Pink and other groups get arrested if they disrupt congressional meetings, etc. I've seen it on CSpan. No one is allowed to disrupt the business of Congress.
Here are some videos of the disruptors tonight in Tampa FL:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HbBgjc...
They aren't there to have civil discourse and get their questions answered. They are there to prevent a productive meeting from occurring. This isn't democracy in action. A similar event occurred in Michigan today, and in Lloyd Doggett's district last weekend. They should be arrested just like Code Pink.
I would not worry too much about the ban list because even though you do stir the pot up quite a bit; they do bring up your name in ridicule ,when you are away….. I’m quite surprised I’m not on that list because all the good guys are on the right… I’m sure I made honorable mention. You are more conservative than many of them are but you supported Obama, so that qualifies you for the list..lol
The forum has become less hostile than it used to be because most of the Obama supporters have left. Remember in that two years of primaries, the posters were about even, after the election most of them left…. The comment history will show that several need to look in the mirror before accusing others of being rude, disruptive, and insensitive… I take my share of the blame.
I would look at the comment history of the accuser before taking action… It may be just a tit for tat….. It’s fairly easy to get 10 or more supporters from the right, in the current format of this forum but that just constitutes group think..IMO
Got to go..Hang in
BigJ, I don’t recall the poster’s screen name but we used to call him Sailor Man, posted a link and used similar words to describe the intellect, class, and the crime ridden neighborhoods that voted for Obama, saying something to the effect; that only poor minorities voted for Obama in Texas because the more pure Conservative districts voted for McCain…… To my surprise, several posters that did not vote for Obama, called him out….. We will never know what the intent was but perception means a lot….. Not one poster backed him up, but that was over seven months ago, maybe things have changed.
BJ, why don't you back-off and leave the lady alone, show some kind of respect, although it might hurt your ego for for a short period.
Maybe thuggery should not have been used as a noun. Perhaps thuggish as an adjective. I have not hard of any robbers or murderers or even an a ruffian at any of these townhall meetings. "thuggery"?
I was addressing Mike. That statement Johnny made about the crime was made in a sarcastic manner. You do know what that is don't you? He was saying to not blame the conservatives blame both sides. You are not allowed to cuss or name call. I will flag your comment.
MIke-I'm sorry but I just don't see the racist tone like you do.
Johnny posted “demeaning people proffering up very valid questions. One guy asked if he has had a chance to read the bill.”
Anyone that has spent any time watching or listening to the healthcare debate, knows that congress five Health Care bills out there. Lloyd Doggett is working on one of three house versions which will be merged and passed to the Senate Finance Committee ,unless the Democrats decide to go it alone and use Reconciliation…. Lloyd Doggett is on the committee working on one version of the bill; of course he’s familiar with the contents….. This reading every line and memorizing all 1000 pages is it just the current talking point. As Lloyd Doggett told the crowds, all five versions are on -line. You didn’t really have to be present at the rally because most of the event was filmed and put on YouTube.
Mike- what did Johnny say that you feel is racist? I have read his posts and yours and was curious what exactly it was?
JohnnyYou’re taking one meeting and turning into a racial /class warfare event.
What are you implying? Are you that outraged by the word “thuggery?”Anti-health care protesters recently hung up an effigy of Rep. Frank Kratovil (D-MD) outside his district office in Salisbury, MD. Is that a sign of intelligence?
“That, or there may be too many middle-school drop outs in the DNC who do not understand the meaning of that simple 5th grade word.”
“Yep... lots of violent assaults and murders going on in conservative neighborhoods, and absolutely none happening in those areas with strong Obama support.”
You are welcome to check the demographics of the Obama supporters but don’t be surprised that you will find that more college graduates voted for Obama than McCain, a look at the map in United States that is colored Blue ,might just be higher than the southern regional conservative area because Obama won more states.
Glenn Beck just lost three big advertisers’, Nexis-Lexis, Proctor and Gamble and Progressive Insurance because he called the president a racist.
I was not at the Austin rally, so I will not call Lloyd Doggett a liar but other sources back up his claim.
The lobbyist-run groups Americans for Prosperity and Freedom Works, which orchestrated the anti-Obama tea parties earlier this year, are now pursuing an aggressive strategy to create an image of mass public opposition to health care and clean energy reform. A leaked memo from Bob MacGuffie, a volunteer with the Freedom Works website Tea Party Patriots, details how members should be infiltrating town halls and harassing Democratic members of Congress.
The memo included such instructions as “You need to rock-the-boat early in the Rep’s presentation, Watch for an opportunity to yell out and challenge the Rep’s statements early.”Also, “The goal is to rattle him, get him off his prepared script and agenda. If he says something outrageous, stand up and shout out and sit right back down. Look for these opportunities before he even takes questions.
Things will even out now since the AFL- CIO will bring their thugs to the party.. The paid for protesters vs. the union…
Apparently the DNC doesn't know the definition of mob either:
mob [mob] –noun 1. a disorderly or riotous crowd of people. 2. a crowd bent on or engaged in lawless violence.
No riot, no lawless violence. Only a politician who lost his ability to relate to his constituents and let his ego take the best of him and show his true colors.
J, point is, Doggett lied, he started the unrest. The ego-maniac was trying to intimidate the audience.
I know somebody personally that was there.
This was at a "townhall" meeting in Austin. The kind that are in existence for the SOLE PURPOSE of getting constituent input. Then he begins demeaning people proffering up very valid questions. One guy asked if he has had a chance to read the bill. He said he didn't. The man began to point out areas of concern that he asked Doggett to look further into before casting his vote. The yelling started, as I said, when he said he did not care what concerns his constituents have, he's voting for it anyway and does not need to read it.
Dogget's a big fat liar. He was given the chance to speak. He was shouted down after he stated that he was going to vote for the President's health care proposal regardless of what his constituents think.
This is the Democrat word of the year. I've probably heard "thug" more often in the last month than in my entire life.
Use of this word to describe peaceful protestors is a prime example of "scare tactics".
That, or there may be too many middle-school drop outs in the DNC who do not understand the meaning of that simple 5th grade word.
thug [thuhg] –noun 1. a cruel or vicious ruffian, robber, or murderer. 2. (sometimes initial capital letter) one of a former group of professional robbers and murderers in India who strangled their victims.
Origin: 1800–10; < Hindi thag lit., rogue, cheat
Yep... lots of violent assaults and murders going on in conservative neighborhoods, and absolutely none happening in those areas with strong Obama support.
What is a "high them high" mentality?
GOP = Group of Psychos
This is Nixon's party, remember? The party of dirty tricks, misdirection, and LIES.
Wouldn't it be nice if the GOP would grow up and actually debate the issues involved instead of resorting to lies?
I guess that's all they have now, crazy people running off half-cocked, in lockstep with the GOP's direction and talking points.
Those people are not activists, they are thugs. They don't want discussion, they want disruption so that civil discourse cannot occur.
Hmmm, do we see much of that here on the comments?
Pure politics, and nothing is ever fair in politics.
Life isn't fair, and politics d#$^ sure isn't.
So some people show up, bussed in or not, to express their views on a subject.
IF those people very presence is enough to make the speakers throw up their hands and leave, then obviously the speakers where NOT PREPARED for anything but a receptive and supportive audience.
"That's not FAIR, these people are a thuggish MOB, THEY don't agree with ME, I'm going to leave, I didn't expect this.....sob, sob sob"
BigJBefore I leave for the night,I've got to say if the Gallup Poll is right,then I was wrong the other day when I said Texas was not in play...Democrats 42% Republicans or lean Republican 40%..Unbelievable but it is just a snapshot in time.
So you were right,for now:-)
xringWithout the benefit of Sun Tzu, I believe the same thing…I do read the right-wing blogs, listen to Rush (only if I ‘m driving around town), read George Will, Kathleen Parker, and David Brooks just to see where the trouble waters and dividing line really is….Will, Parker, and Brooks are conservatives that can see the fallacy in both parties, as humans, they will stray from time to time, but I find them to be truthful.
I have never pretended to be a moderate, so just about anything I write about will be a case of the “pot calling the kettle black.” Thuggery might have been harsh but rude, belligerent, or paid protester did not come to mind…At some point in time we must hold someone responsible instead of using this “they did it too” excuse…I don’t like rude whether it’s left or right..Let the protesters ask their questions, let the representative respond and allow the other attendees the same consideration…I respect the lobbyist constitutional right to petition the government but when they pay people to disrupt, it reminds me of the old union strike breakers.....Now, if all the native Victoria conservatives banded together and won control of a town hall meeting, then that’s democracy. The will of the people. That’s why I don’t complain about conservative Texas, to the winner goes the spoils….I know there are a lot of legitimate angry, confused, and disruptive people that will make their views known and not be televised.
You are not the first to do a little constructive criticism,in the 3 plus years of blogging, I have been advised to give both sides many, many times…I do appreciated you reading my blog, your kind words but I also enjoy the civil exchange.
Have a good one
Mike – As far as asking for fairness in right winged blogs, I typically don't read right wing blogs just like I don’t read BigJ’s blogs. Primarily, because they don’t provide any additional useful information that hasn’t been stated ad nauseam.
I do read left wing stuff for educational purposes as well as to try to gain insight to their thought process. Of course, I’m a big proponent of Sun Tzu, and believe that to be effective one must understand his adversary.
On the “Birthers” issue, that is a category that I put with “Area 51 and UFO’s”. They are merely a distraction and not relevant to change things in the political environment. As far as who claims them or whom they claim..nobody cares. They are moot in the political scheme of things.
Believe it or not, I really do enjoy reading your blogs because they are interesting to say the least. However, I think this particular subject that you chose is really a glass house. It does not hold true merit due to the guilt of the accuser. A case of the pot calling the kettle black.X
You know, Yesterday, I heard Chris Matthews quote some polls that said liberals though Bush had inside information on the 9/11 attacks and since the Birther movement came up, he said liberals brought up John McCain’s birth certificate….
I have to plead ignorance or naivety on both of those claims…..I did hear of the all the 9/11 conspiracy theories but I never thought it was about ideology..I remember Bill Maher (no conservative) chasing some 9/11 conspiracy nuts off his show….As for McCain, I am pretty sure it came out in 2000, in his first run for the presidency but I researched it and in February of 2008 MSNBC ran a story about the liberal bloggers questioning his qualifications…That one got by me…Anyway I never believed the 9/11 conspiracy and McCain has always been a natural born citizen.
I thought so but when I looked it up ..It had VERB:BUS(bused,busing,..also bussed,bussing,busses)but a lot of things get by my dirty trifocals...Thanks
Sounds to me like they have simply learned to play the liberal Democrats game. Maybe the next election will be more interesting.
Factcheck.org, it nothing more than the opinion of someone else.
It is BUSSED not bused.
BTW xring I don't think the Birthers or the other activist groups claim the GOP….If I am correct Libertarians do not like either party but it is for certain they are not Democrats...True, Republicans are defending them.
I believe the Left is a little scared. Documented fact OB has lied, Healthcare.. Video does not lie. Writer, ding good two step you have, dancing with the stars..
xringOk, let’s talk fair..How many times have you gone into a right-wing blog and ask for fairness?
I have written a blog about ACORN…Exposing those myths. They were debunked by Factcheck.org but I will be happy to read any credible link you provide to prove me wrong. And there’s no evidence of any such democracy-destroying fraud. Here's what is true: In recent years, ACORN employees have been investigated multiple times for voter registration fraud. ACORN workers have been convicted of submitting false voter registration forms in Colorado Springs in 2005, Kansas City, Mo., in 2006 and King County, Wash., in 2007. ACORN's Las Vegas office was raided by a state criminal investigator on Oct. 7, 2008. ACORN workers are also the subjects of ongoing investigations in Wisconsin, Missouri, Ohio, Pennsylvania and Indiana. The Indiana investigation started in early October and may involve thousands of fraudulent registration…….,
Like those staffers in Miami, these protesters were taped; photographed and identified…I’m not saying that is the case for all town hall meetings, just the ones selected by the Health Industry lobbyist.
I always laugh when some thinks that wing nut Michelle Malkin is actually a journalist…I don’t think she believes that…What are the other sources Glenn Beck and Ann Coulter?..lol
In another post, I condemned the actions of Code Pink especially when one of them went right up to Condi Rice, when she was leaving a congressional hearing. I am not an activist nor do I approve of being rude and disruptive.
1. This blog is about activists being bused in by a couple of lobbyist groups.2. This blog is not about a presidential town hall meeting..Those will never really become disruptive because of the large presence of law enforcement..Except for the Ron Paulites, Bill Clinton’s appearance in Victoria was rather subdued.3. I wrote” The democrats should not bar the protesters but instead make sure security does not let things get out of hand.”…Imagine being at a town hall in Edna and watching as bused in protesters approach the meeting…Someone is going to get hurt. Lloyd Doggett cut his meeting short and another representative in New York got in his car and left.4. DavidJ2363 said “You sir, are the ultimate hypocrite”..You would have so much more credibility if you went on every right-wing blog in this forum and condemned them as well..”Hypocrite “flows both ways…BTW Yesterday; I did mention the fact that many accused the Dems of wanting Bush to lose the war in Iraq…I also posted my disclaimer “This blog gives me the opportunity to state my mind, but I do not have any illusions that most will agree, in fact quite the contrary. I know the ideology of my birthplace.”5. The content of the blog has not been debunked with a credible source..Truth hurts.6. I do not try to lure anyone into this blog…It’s called free (no pun intended) speech.7. In another blog I named the Democrats on the lobbyist payroll but the right just defends the insurance companies, Big Pharma, and Corporatism.8. I really don’t have to do a thing…ALL the town meetings will now have TV cameras and the PAID PROTESTERS will be exposed.9. If the president’s plan is so bad, prove the point with document facts, not hyperbole lies, doctored vid clips, paid protesters, and fear-mongering…Those tactics did not work in 2006-08, no reason to think they will in 2009.10. Truth hurts and it will in 2010.
THIS IS NOT A CUT AND PASTE….lol
O.k. Mike - it is time for you to be fair in your "thuggery" claim. Let's see you write a blog that is just as harsh about ACORN or the DNC.
I happen to believe that the vast majority of those attending are truely members of the citizen population of that particular town. The president its directly tied to ACORN, and they have been formally documented to "bus" protestors in that are paid professionals. The Democratic party has dirty hands if not dirtier than the Republicans in this arena.
"There is a time when the operation of the machine becomes so odious, makes you so sick at heart, that you can't take part; you can't even passively take part, and you've got to put your bodies upon the gears and upon the wheels, upon the levers, upon all the apparatus, and you've got to make it stop. And you've got to indicate to the people who run it, to the people who own it, that unless you're free, the machine will be prevented from working at all!"
The "machine" is the problem, not some puppet-for-hire like Barack Obama. You guys give the President too much credit. Every argument you have that centers around the Prez perpetuates the lie that he has power while it's the Congress that has failed us via the party opposition illusion. You guys should go take a high school government class instead of watching the news. Wake up folks!
To the writer of Right Wing Thugs;
Stop implying that hard working Americans do not have a right to free speech under the 1st amendment of the U. S. Constitution.
You claim to be a person of fact, but you continue to get so called facts from sources that have little or no creditability, to whom continue to shot holes in the Constitution. Then you continue to hide behind the Constitution.
I will continue to believe in the Constitution from the time of conception until the present and for all the soldiers who have made the extreme sacrifice so people like you’re self can continue write garbage about the hard working Americans that believe in the Constitution.
The love affair you have for this President, may he allow you one night in the Lincoln bed room.
Peace to you and Jane Fonda….
Socialist, left wing, whiner and cry baby - what do you expect?
In her Townhall.com article titled "Tea Party-bashers Gone Wild today, Michelle Malkin pointed out:
"Some panicked congressional targets of the Tea Party movement have responded by shutting their offices, closing their blinds and shooing pesky constituents off public property. The White House health czar's office is mustering up Internet snitches to report "inaccurate" blog posts and "casual conversations" from health care opponents. And LIBERAL BLOGGERS and cable yakkers are waging their own war on the Tea Party movement by redefining participatory democracy as "THUGGERY" and "HOOLIGANISM." (emphasis mine)
Talking Points Memo blogger Josh Marshall bemoaned a fiscal conservative activist's memo offering advice on how to "pack the hall … spread out" and challenge a politician early "to rattle him, get him off his prepared script and agenda." Horrors! "This amounts to a sort of civic vigilantism," Marshall fretted.
No, showing up at a congressional town hall and booing a talking points-programmed political hack isn't "civic vigilantism." Throwing rocks, pouring cement on train tracks, blocking military shipments, smashing windows, hurling paint, slashing tires, vandalizing businesses and throwing shoes are vigilante acts.
That is what the anti-war, anti-free trade, anti-Bush mobsters did over the last eight years -- and there wasn't a peep about those brute tactics from Obama's blogging pals.
They sat quietly while Code Pink disrupted hearings on the Hill and harassed Marine recruiters. They looked the other way when ACORN illegally broke into homes and stormed foreclosure auctions. They gave their tacit approval to self-declared "bank terrorists" like Boston housing entitlement organizer Bruce Marks, who shows up at the schools of bank executives' children and bullies them because of their parents' employment in the name of social justice. Now, the taxpayers footing the bill for Obama's redistribution of health and wealth are silent no more -- and the unhinged Left is beside itself. The "thoughtful" left-wing response to the Tea Party counterinsurgency can best be summed up by hysterical Hollywood actress Janeane Garafolo, who railed last week: "F**ng redneck d**chebaggery. Unmitigated d**chebaggery."
It's not the town halls that have gone wild. It's the Tea Party-bashers who can't tolerate peaceful, open dissent." ((http://townhall.com/columnists/Michel...)
Say, isn't "Right-wing Thuggery" a Democrat "talking point"?
Post some more lies from the LEFT!
"filtered & safe"? Seriously?? How many crazy women were hauled off while attempting "citizens arrests" against Bush, Cheney, etc? What was scary was how close they actually were able to get to the leaders of our country before they were detained. That would NEVER happen now.
VBB and JohnnyH, dead on about the double standard. Hillary Clinton claimed it was just that they questioned Bush.
I thought you at least were more mature than PMSNBC, Constantly Nagging Network snake belly pundits WalMart journalist but I guess you are there.
Teabaggers?? You know what they are saying when they say it. Be advised, ever run across a mature grown up woman like my wife and say that about her you will be introduced to...well I'll let you find out what a woman with higher standards does.
JohnnyBush had ticketed events...Security made sure he had a filtered, safe venue but the Democratic legislators are not allowed to speak and neither are the constituents....They do remind me of the labor strikes where thugs were used.
Code Pink, Moveon.org etc..protesting & disrupting (attempting citizens arrest & other nonsense)while Bush was in office wasn't "thuggery" I guess. I thought we were allowed to peacefully protest & we were protected by the First Ammendment to speak our minds? I guess not during the Obama presidency...now any nay sayers are thugs & criminals.
Those darned activists. They are just as bad now as they were back in 1776. How dare they peacefully protest against a tyrannical power structure.
Alos, it seems to me you don't know the definition of a thug.