• Gyroscope
    You do know that Rasmussen poll leans right.

    Published: August 8, 2009
    WASHINGTON — The changing global climate will pose profound strategic challenges to the United States in coming decades, raising the prospect of military intervention to deal with the effects of violent storms, drought, mass migration and pandemics, military and intelligence analysts say.

    When those who believe in global warming are asked what they think is the main cause of the situation, there is widespread belief that human behavior — such as driving and burning too much fossil fuel like coal and oil — is a contributor to the problem. Four in ten Americans say people are to blame outright (41 percent) and another 38 percent think it is a combination of human action and normal climate patterns. Few believe that global warming is an entirely natural occurrence (14 percent).,2933,2...

    Not only do Americans think global warming is real, but most (58%) believe that increases in the Earth's temperature over the last century are due more to the effects of pollution from human activities. Only 36% believe they are the result of natural changes in the environment that are not due to human activities. This is the crux of much scientific and political controversy surrounding global warming, and puts the public firmly on the side of the environmental movement. Attitudes on this have not changed appreciably since the question was first asked in 2001.

    So what poll are you going to believe?But that is for another day.

    August 17, 2009 at 4:44 p.m.

  • Glad you brought that up…A hypocrite is a person who professes beliefs and opinions that he or she does not hold in order to conceal his or her real feelings or motives.

    I hold my beliefs, I do not try to conceal my real feeling or motives…I reveal my party identification in my profile, I have donkey avatar. What else do you want?…I never profess to be a moderate or conservative.….I have recently quoted Chris Mattews,Jon Stewart, Lawrence O’Donnell but I think I have only quoted Keith a couple of times but I am sure it was relevant to the story. I know Keith is a bias liberal, so what?. It is a public forum and when you see that avatar, you must know what to expect.

    Your idea that if I criticize Fox, I cannot quote MSNBC is ludicrous…You bought in to that “fair and balance” slogan….Fox leans right and MSNBC leans left.

    I like MSNBC because it is basically a political channel….They cannot lead me astray because if I am interested in a subject like Health Care Reform, I have several reliable sources like weekly magazines, Kaiser Foundation, the Sunday talk shows,etc….

    You seem to forget, I write a blog using my opinion and sources and I am not forcing anyone to agree with my opinion or facts..It is also your right to call me hypocrite but I don’t have to agree.

    You root for your side; I will root for mine.

    August 17, 2009 at 4:30 p.m.

  • Gyroscope
    Take a deep breath….Fear mongering is a tactic, whether it works or not is a different subject..The GOP is using fear mongering tactics

    Alternative fuels is the cap-and –trade bill….Some monies have been set aside in the budget, stimulus bill and the cap-and- trade bill. They are all interconnected…I thought everyone knew that.

    “Why should lobbyists waste their money on Republicans” was not a literal statement….The lobbyist have them on retainer and they cover all their bases…The GOP have lined their pockets with oil money for years…”drill baby drill”…That’s not a big secret.

    Of course the cap-and –trade bill will be a Democratic bill…Half of the GOP are global warming deniers. The other half think earth has only existed for 6000 years.:-)

    August 17, 2009 at 3:45 p.m.

  • ..."To susie Been there, done that, never thought about it at the time. Knew there was no free handouts so we didn't moan and cry about working overtime etc"...

    Take yourself out of the equation and then think about it. Lets see if your mind can think that far outside of yourself. With millions off of public aid and nowhere to turn....THINK ABOUT IT.

    The first thing that comes to my mind is economy takes a drastic nosedive..even more than now.

    There would be no such things as single-family homes anymore. 3-4 generations in one house for those who had family. Living on the streets for those who didn't. Theft and murder would be rampant. These are just a few things that jump into my mind. You name some more negative things that would happen.

    The only positive thing that I can picture is that people that come over here for the freebies wouldn't have a reason to come.

    August 17, 2009 at 3:28 p.m.

  • Gyroscope ,that is so wrong…You are right the Republican Party is irrvelant at this junction and the Dems will probably use reconciliation to pass the bill but they are not afraid of political suicide. This is what the Democratic Party and President Obama campaigned on..64 million people knew this was one the biggest issues…..The town halls, are so yesterday…When congress reconvenes, that will all be forgotten…Bigger fish to fry.

    You seem to forget this country have Democrats living here, also,

    August 17, 2009 at 3:08 p.m.

  • Anyone can (and they have)use use that word "hypocritical" on just about any post..I have been in this formum for over three years and I have yet to meet that poster without a bias...Mine is front and center.

    August 17, 2009 at 2:56 p.m.

  • gyroscope you have to quit wearing your GOP feelings on your sleeve.:-)

    Do a little research before accusing….In the Health Care Reform I have already written as to how disappointed I was in the Democrats for taking in so much lobbyist money..The six committee members have received a lot of lobbyist money.(Republicans and Democrats)

    Why would the lobbyist pay the republicans? They are out of power and do not head any committee…They are lobbying the democrats..That’s common knowledge.

    Ten key Democrats are from coal-mining states, so the house bill is in serious jeopardy.
    It is so silly to be worrying about the water downed Cap-and -trade bill that was passed by a majority of 1 vote in the house…That political move was just to just bring the ball into mid-court(the senate)…. The senate has not even debated the bill. The HCR bill will take up much of September and some of October, so it probably won’t come up this year.

    This is the Democratic plan…Pass Health Care Reform first, they can allow 40 of the 52 conservative Democrats (Blue Dogs) to vote, no, and still send it to the senate. Nancy Pelosi will have some serious negotiations with the Blue Dogs before tackling Cap-and –trade..Perhaps a chairmanship of an important committee or some other concession.

    Remember in the off elections, the opposition party will pick up some seats, so the political wheels are constantly turning.

    August 17, 2009 at 2:49 p.m.

  • That is so true Suzy.

    Just envision a year ago when this country was going over a financial cliff and John McCain said “the fundamentals of the economy are strong”, Phil Graham said we were just a bunch of whiners, and a timid President Bush came out with a weekly two minute pep talk without details. Where were the Tea Parties?
    Imagine being on the brink of disaster without the safety nets like Social Security,Medicare,Medicade,Unemployment insurance and food stamps for the unfortunate. You don’t have to visualize that because those programs were already in place when the financial market collapsed…The free-marketers of this disaster want to socialize their losses and privatize their gains.

    I know every living conservative worked from dawn to dusk (don’t take my word for it; ask them) but others got laid off through no fault of their own.

    August 17, 2009 at 2:23 p.m.

  • Gyroscope said “but you (Mike) defend their actions but never cease to point out and criticize the same behavior on the part of Repubs when they were in power.”That’s a vice versa; so why am I being singled out?

    You can criticize the Democrats all you want and you will not see me complain; that’s for the naïve or the squeamish..I will provide a different side supported with sources…I am a political junkie so I know how the game is played…Someone said that partisan politics probably started 10 minutes after Washington was elected….

    August 17, 2009 at 2:05 p.m.

  • I wish people would close their eyes and envision a United States without Welfare, Medicaid, Medicare, and food stamps.

    Seriously, put your feeling aside and just envision it.

    August 17, 2009 at 12:26 p.m.

  • Gyroscope, Larry: I never said Medicare was free..I said it was a single payer system unlike the VA single payer system; a supplemental is deducted from the Social Security checks. I said @the 1.45% that was deducted over the work period, will not pay for a major surgery, for a lot of recipients.

    I may one of the very few that will write in a defensive style for the left side..I am outnumbered 10-1 at least…I have to be extra careful not to use hyperbole, half-truths, distortions or outright lies. Why is that a bad thing?

    We are old enough to know about the nastiness and arm twisting methods of LBJ….It started getting worse after Watergate…After that it was the Clinton impeachment then the 2000 election…This is the reason President Obama does not really want to investigate the previous administration; it makes it nearly impossible to negotiate or pass legislation.

    It is easy to label me a ultra partisan and to forget one’s bias in this ultra conservative city because being on the far right is considered normal….I understand that.


    People should know what an outcome of an election will bring..Only the naïve think the winning party will not try to repay their constituents, donors, and follow an ideological platform…There is always another election.

    Fact is when one party has all the power they are called authoritarians and the minority; obstructionist.

    Another fact: Nothing has changed; the republicans were against Social Security back in the 30s and used the same fear mongering tactics back then..We have all heard the commercial Ronald Reagan made 40 years ago, calling Medicare socialize medicine….2009 Health Care Reform: The GOP,players, have changed but the message and tactics have not.

    August 17, 2009 at 12:22 p.m.

  • Regardless of who won, I thought the POTUS was supposed to do what is best for all the citizens of this country, not just the people that supported him. Just because your party is in power doesn't mean they should shove through legislation that the citizens don't agree with & as it stands right now the majority of Americans don't like what they are seeing as far as his healthcare plan goes.

    Talk about childish elitism.....nana booboo I won get over it, they're my toys you can't play.

    Legion you are oh so correct in your last response. I'm giving you an internettal high five!

    August 16, 2009 at 10:18 p.m.

  • Medicare is not free care for the elderly! part A is paid by deductions from your paycheck starting in a 1964 law. Part B is paid monthly from your SS check! Then you go to page 38 of the medicare manual and see what is NOT covered! this is why you see Medigap insurance ads on TV. Look at what medicare pays for a hospital stay! Suprise! You also pay for the first two pints of blood! Oh, they gloss over items to make you feel good but wait till you have an expended hospital stay! We do not need to cover everyone. Some 11 million people do not have coverage although it is available to them on their jobs. Probably less now with the new unemployment figues. But it is a fact that some workers select not to have coverage. The system according to liberals is broke! Well, let's fix it. But you don't buy a new car just because you need front tires on your old car!

    August 16, 2009 at 9:31 p.m.

  • Legion
    Actually it was President Obama that told the GOP senator “We won” but the GOP cannot play victim because they do the same thing and have.
    Yes Barney Frank, Nancy Pelosi, and Harry Reid are partisans but so are John Boehner, Mitch McConnell and Jim DeMint…Equal bomb throwers.

    I believe the majority voted for Democratic ideas in 2008….It’s supposed to be their chance to govern.
    It’s not really about party because all Republican legislators have a conservative mindset…Pro business and thanks to last recruiting class; only 40% of the Democratic Party have a liberal/progressive mindset that want a consumer friendly Health Care System, a green economy, and alternative energy.

    I have to disagree Legion…Look at the vote tally on stimulus, budget, and the really bad cap-and- trade out of the house...The dems have a 79 seat majority in the house and the Cap-and-Trade bill passed by a minimum of one vote 218,YES.

    BTW Don’t we have to let it run its full course before deeming it bad for the country?

    Have a good one..I am out of here.

    August 16, 2009 at 9:24 p.m.

  • And the attitude I just expressed is a factor in why there is not a Republican solution.

    Every time a Republican legislator proposes a different view, they probably encounter the same attitude.

    A sneer and ,IMO "well that's good, but we are in power,your party lost the last election and this is what we want, and we don't want to hear your ideas."

    Actually, I can see Barney Frank or Nancy Pelosi making that statement.

    The new elite, and they don't want debate, they have the votes, their agenda will be passed whether it is good for the country or not.

    August 16, 2009 at 8:54 p.m.

  • Nothing to get angry about Legion357, I was not demeaning you in any fashion…I think you are an intelligent moderate poster with the best intentions and a lot of good solutions..

    I’m the dummy, I believed.

    Read between the lines the conservative Dems will get re-elected, the insurance companies will not get a strong bill, and the lobbyists win again…..Status quo.

    No, I have said time and time again, I am not under any illusions that anyone will agree with me in this city or in this forum…I know my environment.

    I am disappointed in Barack Obama because if I wanted a “watered down “Health Care Reform bill, I would not have been as enthusiastic about finally getting a consumer driven Health care reform bill passed….It’s going to be like that on energy policies etc…An extension of the last miserable eight years….Rahm Emmanuel, Howard Dean, and Senator Chuck Schumer went out and recruited the Blue Dogs to get a majotity; it is now back firing…That’s 52 more Democrats that vote like Republicans in the house and about 10 in the senate.

    Today’s panel told me the direction we are going in..It will be the same for energy,

    August 16, 2009 at 8:52 p.m.

  • As I said in my post

    I know there is not a bill yet Mike.

    You say you want debate? I have tried and all I receive in return is comments you make that seem to demean me and bypass my previous posts. Good way to debate.

    I DO AGREE WITH PARTS OF THE PROPOSED LEGISLATION, I guess I will have to yell it from One O'Connor
    Plaza downtown before you believe it!!

    From your recent replies, I can only gather that you do not want debate, and that you will not be happy until I capitulate and agree with your position.

    August 16, 2009 at 8:27 p.m.

  • Private insurance premiums are going up because they are picking up the costs not paid by Medicare and Medicaid. They are also plagued by stupid mandates. Medicare and Medicaid are also increasing at about 8% per year according to Obeyme's budget - I have heard elsewhere that they are actually increasing faster than that.

    The assumption is that all these costs will go down if we expand the coverage and give more people free healthcare - that defies logic and experience with government run programs. The only cost cutting that I have read about involves "cram down" of doctor and hospital fees - everyone would scream their heads off if the government did this to them.

    Oh, I know they talk about more efficiency, things like electronic record keeping, government death panels and etc. But before we do anything really stupid it seems we ought to try and fix the minor things we have wrong with the current system - in other words get the politicians the he11 out of this.

    August 16, 2009 at 7:51 p.m.

  • Legion357

    You speak of “the bill” but one does not exist.
    Here are some facts I have been saying, yet they are always ignored.

    The final bill after it passes both houses will go to a committee, where the administration will decide what the president will eventfully sign.
    The Senate Finance bill is made of just conservatives(Democrats & Republicans)…They are all from small states where only one or two insurance companies operate….Guess how much health care industry has contributed to those 6…This is where the final bill will pass…Remember that separation of powers, I keep talking about.

    John Rother (president of AMA) and a spokesman for AARP told Chris Wallace that the reform must be big; if it’s going to work.

    I knew the public option was dead when the president did not mention it at his press conference. About two weeks ago.
    It is just politics…Democrats & Obama must pass something or they will be seen as failures….Republicans must obstruct and hope the watered down version fails…AS it stands today.

    A strong bill will have some actual reforms with teeth.....It must be consumer driven not what's best for the insurance companies.

    August 16, 2009 at 7:51 p.m.

  • The GOP offered some amendments, I spoke of what I believe could be a plan that would pass, but like all of us advisers on this site, we don't have the clout or backing to make any of it happen.

    I do agree with some of the points that are presented, just not all, as any legislature probable does whether republican or democrat.

    You are most likely right, a "watered down" bill will be passed, to use the term "watered down" suggest that you hope the exact bill as presented would be passed. And from your posts I know you do in fact disagree with some parts of the bill.

    August 16, 2009 at 7:30 p.m.

  • BTW Legion357
    The public option was going to be used as leverage to keep the insurance companies honest.

    They will now use a private CO-OP as leverage but it will be a place for those who lose their job giving them a better option than COBRA and for those that cannot get or unhappy with their insurance..I think it will be pretty weak ,like the others in existence…..But who know what will happen in two weeks when congress convenes.

    August 16, 2009 at 7:26 p.m.

  • Legion357
    The public option is pretty much dead, so save your math.:-)

    I am for interstate policy buying but it has some draw backs…..Feds would have to be the mediator since some states have some mandates on insurance companies operating in their state…It would actually make insurance go up in the states having the cheaper rates because the riskier people would flock to them.

    You do realize the GOP lost…As the president said, what does the GOP has to offer for Tort reform?..BTW Flordia, California and Missouri did massive tort reform but insurance rates went up anyway….Republicans want to enter tort reform into every bill because like the unions they take away from the bottom line of the corporations (donors) and they vote for the democrats.

    After watching this morning’s NBC, Fox, ABC & CNN’s panels on health care, I am now convinced the Republicans want HCR to fail; for political reasons.

    As senator Kent Conrad (D-ND) told Chris Wallace..President Obama does not have a health plan, congress has 5…Everyone is commenting on House of Representatives 3200(HR3200) but it has only passed committee..It has yet to be debated or voted on….The senate versions has not even made pass committee.

    August 16, 2009 at 7:16 p.m.

  • I can support some of the provisions in the bill, but not all, as many legislatures do.

    August 16, 2009 at 6:53 p.m.

  • Good question Vet, I agree there needs to be health care reform, I've posted that before.

    August 16, 2009 at 6:51 p.m.

  • So let's say this thing falls in the ditch ala '94. Then a possible doubling or tripling of insurance premiums. Who do we blame?

    August 16, 2009 at 6:42 p.m.

  • Wait a second, now I get it, the pay a fine or sign into the public option.

    A $1000 a year fine for individuals that do not buy there own insurance or opt into the public option. By the way what will the public option cost individuals? No ones said. ok

    Anywhere from 26 to 45 million uninsured, depending on which numbers you use, let's say the public option is less than the fine, $800 a year........... D@mn no wonder the government wants to push it through, this is a major cash cow for the federal government.

    August 16, 2009 at 6:30 p.m.

  • One more point, Tort Reform? (which is nowhere to be found in the bill being considered), yes it should have been.

    If it does not reduce costs, explain why anesthesiologists, who determine the amount by body weight, then inject a anesthetic into a IV that a OR nurse placed, then set on there stool and watch monitors, charges about 3 times what a surgeon charges and more than a hospital charges for day surgery?

    Easy question, anesthesiologist bare the brunt of malpractice lawsuits when things, not in anyone s control go wrong. So thus they charge more than surgeons or even hospitals.

    August 16, 2009 at 3:42 p.m.

  • Yeah Mike, I was anticipating your response, any debater does that.

    Yes health care needs reform, but the bill to be debated in congress after the summer break goes to far IMO.

    Purchasing Health Insurance across state lines? Yes, most people already do that with Auto Insurance.

    Allow Medicare and Medicaid to purchase bulk drugs at a discount? Yes, the VA already does that, and also individuals should be allowed to purchase prescription drugs from out of country as long as the country that they come from recognizes the distributors as being reputably.

    Pre-existing conditions? Yes and no, if it is a manageable condition with management (diabetes ect.) yes. A terminal condition or extended care with no hope of recovery? I am not sure about that. It seems to me that it would be like buying auto insurance after a wreck and expect it to be covered. Which also brings up "death panels", which I agree insurance companies already practice.

    I agree the "death panel" argument is a moot point, they already exist.

    Cutting costs. Sigh, why oh why does any hospital anywhere, think they have to purchase the absolute newest piece of medical equipment that comes on the market? Especially our local hospitals, some of the best hospitals in the world are only 2 hours away. And then of course, they have to use their newest toy, and charge the patient, insurance company or government for it's use. (Kind of like people that show up at midnight to buy the latest electronic gadget).

    Ok, that's enough for now.

    August 16, 2009 at 3:26 p.m.

  • Alton
    Call Medicare anything you want; United States government is the only payer; hence single payers…Supplements are deducted from Social Security check…
    BigJ is a conservative and does not want congress to have anything to do with health care, so your first sentence is just plain wrong.

    My doctor told me Friday that he will resume treating me next year when I am on Medicare.
    As I stated that $2.5 billion provision will be dropped because it is not worth all the paranoia.
    This plan will go into law in the year 2013...I have mentioned that several times.

    Democrats do not want distance themselves from Health Care Reform; they all campaigned on that issue…lol As long as your side has Fox,Rush,Palin,Beck,Malkin,Boehner,Hannity,Savage,Backmann,Steele,and no solutions, the Democrats do not have anything to fear.

    August 16, 2009 at 1:59 p.m.

  • Afternoon Legion
    I didn’t know there was a question in your post yesterday; It looked like a one man Q&A session...You asked the questions and assumed my answers.:-)

    You assumed an increase of 1,000 IRS agents for the enforcement of the new HCR plan; not so, if fact the IRS keeps downsizing. This is the reason they wanted to contract tax collections. No reason to believe the IRS would add new personnel; intra -government transfers maybe……Republicans would love to shut down or hinder the IRS.:-)

    HCR has been ignored since 1994...It needs more than a band-aid…$2.6 trillion a year and climbing…Right now, on average the company pays about $9,000 annually for employee insurance and employee pays 3,000 ;equaling to $12,000…More and more companies are dropping their coverage. How many can afford the $12,000 on their own?

    Today’s Houston Chronicle front page stated that obesity kills over 100,000 and costs us $147 billion a year…We would have another riot, if someone suggested a sugar or trans fat tax, so we will ignore that and concentrate on the paper clips, postage expenditures and government take over….The high taxes and many other methods worked for smoking.

    August 16, 2009 at 1:40 p.m.

  • Mike, I have noticed you and BigJ both keep referring to Medicare as a single payer system. I do not know of a single physician or hospital that is willing to accept the small payments received from Medicare as payment in full for services. If you are on Medicare try and get a physician appointment without signing a promise to pay statement for services not paid covered or paid in full by Medicare. Even better try and have surgery at any hospital without making arrangements for paying the difference in Medicare payment and amount billed.
    The patient and Medicare are paying. Or a supplemental insurance policy helps pay. This is not what I would call a single payer.

    There would not be all this BS about the "kill granny" provision, if the HR 3200 bill was clear on this subject.

    PG 425 Lines 4-12 Government mandates Advance Care Planning Consultations

    PG 425 Lines 22-25, 426 Lines 1-3 Government provides approved list of end of life resources, guiding you in how to die.

    PG 427 Lines 15-24 Government mandates program for orders for end of life. The Government has a say in how your life ends.

    PG 429 Lines 10-12 "advanced care consultation" may include an ORDER for end of life plans.

    In the very first sentence of your blog, "the Democratic Party will pass Health Care Reform" is so very true. They will own the bill. Yet I contend they are afraid of the bill and its affect upon elections. They want to distant themselves over time from the bill. They will make excuses for the short comings of the bill. They will tell us the bill never was intended to .......They want the voters to forget about the bill by the next few elections. There will be a new crisis for the voters and news media to focus on. And of course they will contend that only the current elective can solve the new crisis.

    The bill will not be in full force until after the next Presidential election.

    August 16, 2009 at 1:11 p.m.

  • Very interesting:,2933,1...

    August 16, 2009 at 10:36 a.m.

  • "I think you have missed something, granny is the only survivor. Grandpa goes first."
    That must be in the bill(s) too.

    August 16, 2009 at 9:51 a.m.

  • legion..."divide 1 by three and you don't come up with 4"

    Sure you do -- IF you're a politician. Now you understand deficit spending.

    August 16, 2009 at 9:49 a.m.

  • I think you have missed something, granny is the only survivor. Grandpa goes first.

    August 16, 2009 at 9:48 a.m.

  • OK, so they're talking about pulling the plug on granny. So I'm a grandpa, therefore I'm safe since it's a plug pulling fest for grannies.

    August 16, 2009 at 9:27 a.m.

  • If more government control of the health care industry is the answer, why do all projections of Medicare outlays find a $40 Trillion (yes, TRILLION, not billion) deficit over the next 40-50 years? The Democrats' health care proposals, which pointedly ignore this problem, have a distinct element of Nero fiddling while Rome burned. If this is not a Fascist power grab, I have never seen one.

    August 15, 2009 at 6:39 p.m.

  • True Vet, hopefully the Iraq's can handle it in a year or so.

    August 15, 2009 at 6:22 p.m.

  • Wanna save some money? Get out of that money pit in Iraq. God knows we will not only save money, but lives as well.

    August 15, 2009 at 6 p.m.

  • I guess I could do a BigJ.......

    You never answered my question below, are you scared and don't want to admit the truth?

    LOL, don't worry about it, I never expected you to answer them anyway.

    August 15, 2009 at 5:57 p.m.

  • Mike, I don't know what to say, I wasn't dreaming.....

    You really did not say anything,yes I agree health care needs to be reformed, but IMO this is a over ambitious piece of legislation that will do more harm than good.

    "Legion357 it all depends on rounding (IRS does) and how many places you carry the decimal point...Most carry it over by 12 places...Have a good one."

    If I had that much income I wouldn't care who did what.

    August 15, 2009 at 5:52 p.m.

  • Arelwil
    If you survived the last 8 years ,then you know we needed changed..89% said the country was going in the wrong direction…. We went through a war of choice, the Patriot Act, domestic eavesdropping and secret energy meetings and the children survived..Surely, the watered-down Health Care reform bill can’t be worse.

    Budgets can be modified to reflect current conditions…Items go unfunded all the time..Like “No child left behind.”

    August 15, 2009 at 5:36 p.m.

  • Legion357
    Did do you dream of these new expenditures when Homeland Security was created?

    Do you know how much more bureaucracy the private insurance will have once they get about about 25 million new customers? You think your premium will stay the same? These details will have to be worked out.

    As a bottom rung ,arm chair armature analyst, I can see the insurance companies going completely broke in the next 15-20 years because of our life styles and from everything I have seen.…People my age should be paying more because we use the system more but it is exactly the opposite…Too many variables to apply good free-market principals.
    Senator Kent Conrad (D-ND) and Paul Beggala say the public option is dead…I believe that.

    Hindsight is always 20/20 but I now wish the democrats would have just taken out the age 65 and just presented Medicare for all against status quo. Let the people decide…We are going to get a watered-down bill that will not really reform because the democrats can only negotiate within the party.
    Nancy Pelosi might submit a single payer but it will not pass.

    Believe it or not, we have to make it affordable for the working people like you, who will continue paying in the tax to keep this country going…It’s about the working middle-class; they cannot continue to shoulder the burden..It's a shame a team of doctors have to bet set up outside of LA to take of those that have insurance but certain procedures were not covered...1500 people lined up at 4:00AM to get service..We need more than a simple fix....The main reason for the fall of the Roman Empire.

    Legion357 it all depends on rounding (IRS does) and how many places you carry the decimal point...Most carry it over by 12 places...Have a good one.

    August 15, 2009 at 5:24 p.m.

  • "After reform passes"

    Yup a done deal already. The President just said that.

    August 15, 2009 at 5:11 p.m.

  • Live on CNN right now, the president explain the breakdown of stimulus spending, 1/3 in each category..... but he said 1/3 went here, 1/3 went there, another 1/3 went for this AND ANOTHER 1/3 went for that.

    divide 1 by three and you don't come up with 4

    August 15, 2009 at 5:09 p.m.

  • And before you say most of the IRS is automated, I used one of their services, yes straight on the IRS website, not a second party, payed my taxes, then get a letter saying I owed more! They are far from perfect. I didn't argue, it wasn't much, but it was the IRS's worksheet(that I depended on) that was wrong, and their mistake cost me all of $.15 interest, woohoo, they'd be broke without that.


    August 15, 2009 at 4:55 p.m.

  • Mike
    You are right, I am scared. I am scared that the country I grew up in is being dramatically changed. The freedom and liberty that I have enjoyed may not be available for my children and grandchildren. The "Silent Majority" has been awakened and is the only hope I have.

    August 15, 2009 at 4:44 p.m.

  • I did use the minus key Mike, I cut it in half per your post.

    My point is that any medical service currently provided by Medicare that will be reduced or cut, is in fact a reduction of benefits, contrary to your "This is the truth" comment.

    Yes health care needs REFORM, not a complete overhaul, but your mind is made up, any suggestion you or I make will not make any difference anyway.

    The largest employer in America will get what it wants, and then pass more legislation to deal with the aftermath at another time.

    How in Gods green earth can adding at least 3 more layers of bureaucracy to a less than perfect system actually result in savings?

    Does not it make sense to change a few parts of the system, instead of, and yeah your going to say that's not what there doing, instead of modifying the current system?

    Let me ask this, I know no one can answer it, not the CBO, White House or Congress, how many new bureaucrats and there support staff, plus office space, equipment ( everything from computers, servers, coffee makers, office chairs and desks)will all this actually cost?

    IMO, a few thousand new employees to administer the public option, plus a few thousand more at the IRS to impose non compliance. A brand spanking new building, all new equipment ect.

    Unless of course all employees of these layers of bureaucracy are stripped from other departments, nah the AFGE* would throw a fit, that isn't going to happen.

    *The American Federation of Government Employees (AFGE) is the largest federal employee union, representing 600,000 workers in the federal government and the government of the District of Columbia.

    August 15, 2009 at 4:43 p.m.

  • I don't know what your definition of "broke" is but according to Obama's budget revenue from Medicare taxes is $191 billion and expenditures are $425 billion in 2009. We don't have to wait until 2019 to announce it's "broke."

    And please don't tell me you are counting on the Medicare "trust fund" for anything, it's like the social security trust fund, it's gone, nada, zippo, etc.

    August 15, 2009 at 4:39 p.m.

  • Vet, they are coming at you in full force better join the local Tea Party protesters for protection.:-)

    I heard an elderly lady shout out “liar liar pants on fire” at a town hall meeting…Must have been a senior moment…..I was waiting for “I am rubber ,you are glue.”

    August 15, 2009 at 4:27 p.m.

  • Hello itisi
    I bet I have heard the president speak more than you have or ever will and I have never heard him say that and I provided a source….We will let that go.

    I am almost with you on that second point because I wish more people like that welder from Montana would stand up and say “you can't pay for this because we are broke.”instead of that other garbage....….Truth is ,presidents have been throwing figures around for ages, the two tax cuts for the rich was supposed to give us economic stability and prosperity..Can you feel it?

    Both parties KNOW Health Care needs reform, the GOP was in power for 8 years ,4 of those they controlled everything ,yet they did not mention it.

    …The chickens have come home to roost… IMO

    August 15, 2009 at 4:18 p.m.

  • Legion357
    There you go using that calculator that does not have a minus key….:-)

    $500 billion IN PROJECTED savings will just maintain…You can’t divided that into today’s Medicare’s recipients because many will be added by 2013 ;the year of the health Care reform bill will go into law…..Medicare will go broke in 2019, unless we do some serious reforming.

    Do you really put much stock in 10 year projections? I don’t, even if it benefits me.

    August 15, 2009 at 4:03 p.m.

  • Now ya'll are getting silly,but I know, since the Pres. was elected by a *majority*, lets just go ahead and rubber stamp every little idea he has.

    Hasn't that happened every time for OHHHH 20 , 30 years or so? Why should we be different?

    D@mn the torpedoes, full speed ahead.

    August 15, 2009 at 4:01 p.m.

  • Is he going to borrow the dude's copy of "My Pet Goat"?

    August 15, 2009 at 3:45 p.m.

  • I heard that President Obama has contacted the National Hurricane Center, wanting to know how he can make a hurricane just like the former President.

    August 15, 2009 at 3:40 p.m.

  • Just got a letter in the mail saying I've been accepted to sit on a "death panel".

    August 15, 2009 at 3:31 p.m.

  • President OB, has stated time after time he will cut programs, and 500 billion from Medicare over 10yrs. Come on this dog and pony show he’s putting on is a JOKE. He will do what ever it takes to get his healthcare through. The numbers President OB is coming up with is just like pulling a rabbit out of a hat.

    It’s just a damn shame that someone does not have enough courage in congress. “You know MR. President you might be wrong on this one.”

    The numbers of insured VS. uninsured, there is no parallel, 80 & 20 that is a 60 percent margin. Where is his justification on the uninsured. Maybe attorneys can’t add or subtract.

    As for as the seniors go the only one that has put fear in this equation is the President. He just can’t sell it. Healthcare plan to reform to healthcare insurance. Ding when a man continues to talk out of both sides of his mouth it’s just hard believe that his shooting straight or telling the truth.

    August 15, 2009 at 3:27 p.m.

  • lol vet

    August 15, 2009 at 3:19 p.m.

  • Boy, you talk about being stuck between Iraq and a hard place, I'm a veteran, grandparent, but not quite on Medicare. What to do?
    I heard today that at age 65, everyone will get a set of operating tools so they can perform surgeries on themselves. Not only that, David Vitter will offer stock in diapers at a cut rate. What a deal!

    August 15, 2009 at 3:09 p.m.

  • 'scuse me, payments made for care for the elderly

    August 15, 2009 at 3:04 p.m.

  • Kind of like local taxes, appraisals go up, well it's only $15 for a $100k house, plus the county tax, plus VISD, plus drainage district, plus Victoria college tax.

    "where only asking you to pay a little more", yeah but so is everyone else.

    A billion here a billion there and pretty soon your talking about real money.

    August 15, 2009 at 2:55 p.m.

  • 2008 numbers(as current as I could find) Total Medicare Beneficiaries
    United States 44,831,390, less than what is claimed as uninsured, barely.

    IF the reduction is truly 500B it amounts to roughly $1100 a beneficiary, half that if is (cough) 250B

    August 15, 2009 at 2:50 p.m.

  • A mind reader

    August 15, 2009 at 2:46 p.m.

  • LOL, Medicare does not send "old people" a payment, it pays for Medical services, if some of the services that are currently paid by medicare are cut or reduced, how is that not a cut in benefits? Not payments to "old people".

    August 15, 2009 at 2:27 p.m.

  • maybe they are going to go after all the waste. To cut $500 billion doesn't mean it will all come from payments made to old people. There are a lot of other areas that can be cleaned up and made more efficient.

    August 15, 2009 at 2:16 p.m.

  • Geez talk about political double speak

    "extracts $500 billion from projected Medicare spending over 10 years, as scored by the Congressional Budget Office, by doing such things as trimming projected increases in the program’s payments for medical services, not including physicians. Increases in other areas, such as payments to doctors, bring the net savings down to less than half that amount. But none of the predicted savings – or cuts, depending on one’s perspective – come from reducing current or future benefits for seniors."

    So it's only $250 Billion, due to increased payments to physicians derived from cuts in other medical services. What "other" medical services currently paid by medicare won't be? And how is it that "other" medical service will be cut or reduced, can those cuts or reduction not affect current or future benefits?

    IF a medical service was paid by medicare and then it will not be is not that a cut in benefits?

    August 15, 2009 at 2:09 p.m.

  • It would seem people would research before posting myths,half-truths,lies, or distortions on a public forum.

    False: Medicare Benefits Will Be Slashed

    The claim that Obama and Congress are cutting seniors’ Medicare benefits to pay for the health care overhaul is outright false, though that doesn’t keep it from being repeated ad infinitum.

    The truth is that the pending House bill extracts $500 billion from projected Medicare spending over 10 years, as scored by the Congressional Budget Office, by doing such things as trimming projected increases in the program’s payments for medical services, not including physicians. Increases in other areas, such as payments to doctors, bring the net savings down to less than half that amount. But none of the predicted savings – or cuts, depending on one’s perspective – come from reducing current or future benefits for seniors.

    The president has promised repeatedly that benefit levels won’t be reduced, reiterating the point recently in Portsmouth, N.H.:

    August 15, 2009 at 1:45 p.m.

  • Didn't the Democrats say they wanted to rip $500 billion out of medicare? How are they going to do that with out killing granny (and gramps to be PC)?

    August 15, 2009 at 1:11 p.m.