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Complacent? Some say not worrying about climate change is complacent or the war in Iraq or the incompetence so I did my fair share of railing against that.Like I said it’s never about me; I hardly ever personalize any topic…It may seem like I do but the battles have been out there forever.I don’t blame anyone for railing against wasteful spending but I don’t think your voice will heard unless it’s about all wasteful spending. The bailout was a good example; although the Treasury Secretary, Fed Chairman and President came out and said we needed to bailout the banks immediately or the economy would collapse right then and there; voters got on the phone and jammed the WH phone bank and their representatives got an ear full but some believed the WH officials (as I would have) and voted for it anyway.We will probably never agree on anything but I do understand your point of view and I made a vow to myself ; not to get into the 2008 squabbles..I will slip from time to time.BTW You continue to think I don't have any worries..What if my old company goes under and my pension goes unfunded or they decide not insure retirees and how long will my investments have to stay in treasury bonds (for a safe rate or no rate at all) ? Business Week named several companies that are doing that...I will say again we are all in this together..I want the economy stimulated and I want to put people back to work.
Like I have stated earlier, you can afford not to worry. I, on the other hand, am quite a bit younger & would like to save for our retirement, so any wasteful spending I take very personally. People getting back more than they pay in pisses me off & plenty ofothers too. We cannot & should not become complacent.
VBBYes, I understand the concept, I hope Texas goes democratic but I know I have control over the votes or a way to change the gerrymandered line, so I live with it and accept it. Every four years a candidate runs on some kind of flat tax and they get defeated. The Fairtax fairy tales has been debunked on Factcheck.org. In fact I wrote a blog about it and I remember going back and forth with Ernie on the subject. Dont get me wrong, everyone is in agreement that tax simplification is needed but a flat or consumption has its many flaws because we would have to generate the same amount of revenue and we would still keep the state sales tax.As I said before I dont stay up at night worrying about taxes and or where it goes because waste is waste. It does not matter whether its on some new defense department project that will never get used or welfare.
Mike, correction, I do have some control, limited as it is....I have my vote. The progressive tax system can change if enough people want it to. That day isn't going to come in the next 4 years though. I am sure people will soon grow weary of the current tax system & there will be pressure to change it to something more fair, like a flat tax or a consumption tax. Other people profitting from my hard work does little to benefit me.
VBBI am thinking you meant bailout that was passed and signed by 74 in the senate. The Dems are BigJ’s conservative blue dog democrats. There are southern democrats (for the most part) in highly conservative districts that beat former Republicans. About 40 of them in the house none in the senate. Nancy Pelosi saw she had the votes and she did not want to pass the bailout with just democrats..Not a GOP/Democrat issues both at fault or if the toxic loans work out some time in the future it will be a gain.That’s over and Obama just told the GOP house and senate he does not want ownership of the stimulus package.“No use getting angry over something that is not under your control” is my motto…No one is going to change the progressive tax system any time soon.BTW that is the middle –class just for the tax cut….It has been defined many ways.When the majority of people benefit; then I benefit…I don’t take this bill or tax code personally.BTW Before you go all giddy on those that voted against the bill ,wait until after the first passage because they knew they would get a do over...I watched their responses and al it would take is adding more for infrastructure.
The first stimulus package was passed by the Dems....how convenient peoples memories are. The Reps did not get behind it until the 2nd go round when people started screaming the world economy would end. Obama & Biden both supported it & now people are placing the blame of that failure squarely on the Republicans who eventually caved. I am glad that the Republicans all united & voted against this one & I am proud of the 11 Dems who listened to their constituency & voted against it as well. Those are some Dems I can support. Well, I found out who the "middle class" are & I'm not one of them even though I don't make $250,000 a year. I am in the same tax bracket as them but I don't get to reap any of the rewards, so I am stuck between a rock & a hard place while being raped. I knew, even though I don't make over $250,000, that I would not get relief, but some people kept insisting that I would qualify. Good thing I never got my hopes up.I still don't understand why some people get what they pay in back + more. That to me it is wrong, it removes the incentive to get ahead & is basically no better than welfare. $1,000. per kid does little to curb people from having them who can't afford them & adds a further burden to our social programs; S Chip, Medicaid, Food Stamps, Free Lunch Programs, etc. We need to change our tax laws & more tax credits for those who pay in nothing, is not the way to go. Oh wait....I get it now.....tax credits to those who get 100% back plus more = redistribution of wealth, without having to call it what it is.
Willette I did not run but I am 63 years and it gets a little tiring doing the right and left wing battle ..I am getting too old for the battle where no one wins....You have not read my posts or blogs because I have scolded my own party , and Obama on the threads because I have never said the "Dems cannot do wrong" and I cannot recall a poster on the left implying that. ....Like I have said many times the blogs I write are my own thoughts and I am not any illusions that it is line with the majority and I am not running for "Prom King" so it's not like I at least want to get Mr. Congeliality...My avatar,tone, post, and blog,profile, lays it all out; so I am not pretending to be a moderate or Independent.It's not my fault the GOP is losing it's members and elections..You can blame the hate rhetoric of talk radio and about 20% of it's members .Friday the GOP will have a new and hopefully a new direction.
Mike, Im sorry that you had to run when facts, not talking points, were put in front of you. I dont want a constant battle between the MSM and democrats, all I want is for them to at least admit that not all of them can walk on water, or their ideas might have just a small flaw in them, instead of ignoring facts of their wrong doing and acting like it never happened. I can remember a man 50 odd years ago telling me I dont give a d*mn if he steals the dome off the Capital, if hes a Democrat I am voting for him. Glad to see the more things change, the more they stay the same!
WillettI am not going to argue the talking points of the right or the left,it doesn't do any good.You represent the 20% of the social conservative republican party that wants a constant battle between the MSM and democrats.We can have that argument another day since I am concentrating on the stimulus package....But sandwichh and others will be glad to have your idealogical input and be in agreement.Have a good day.As President Barack Obama tries to win over reluctant Republicans on his economic stimulus plan, a slim majority of the American public wants to see Congress pass the roughly $800 billion package of new government spending and tax breaks. According to Gallup Poll Daily tracking on Tuesday, 52% of the nation's adults are in favor of Congress passing the plan and 37% are opposed, while 11% have no opinionhttp://www.gallup.com/poll/114028/Sli... BTW I was referring to the United States as a whole not centering on Victoria County and your opinion.
Mike, as for the public not being that delusional, I can read some of the comments in this paper that clearly disputes your statement. You only mention Fox News as a rebuttal, what about the NYT. Its funny how you can only remember the name of one news source to bolster your argument when the MAJORITY of the failing newspapers today are deficiently biased to the left. Kind of makes you wonder doesnt it? Perhaps its because the intelligent people that work to make something of and for themselves are tired of the slant that is being offered, and are now refusing to put their hard earned money into the pockets of the cheerleaders that helped elect Obama. I know you and Obama can say we won and laugh about it but not worry about what is going to be left for our children and grandchildren. Maybe I can get a loan from Blarney Frank, interest free of course, so I will have a little something set aside to leave them
AltonI agree with your logic again...Its going to hurt our reputation.Banks failing or forced to merge will have be a solution but remember we have to keep our credit reputation worldwide if we are going to do all this massive borrowing.We can only cure that one party dominance at the ballot box..The GOP has its work cut out for them.
Hello VetYou hit the nail on the head again...Andrea Mitchell (no ideologue)said it seems to be Obama v Limbaugh ..In fact Limbaugh has an opt ed in this morning's WSJ..He can inject his ideas into this issue and doesn't have to share the blame..He led his flock astray in the 2006 & 2008 elections but they keep coming back for more.
WillettI don't think the American public is that delusional or we will have some kind of media conspricacy..That's for Fox News. If it fails; it falls squarely on the Democrats and it should...The 11 Conservative Blue democrats that voted against are in right wing conservative districts as well as all the conservative house members...This is just the first passage ,the bill will be revised in the senate and the house GOP and the blue dogs will get another chance..National poll numbers show the public is favor of a stimulus package being passed on bipartisan basis.ON th other hand if the package works; the GOP is hoping the voters have a short memory.
Mike, I agree with your response to my comment, except I still fear big government, a single party government by any party, and the massive spending that seems to have no end. I also still contend that oil prices and corrupted money dealers are what have done the world in. After all not all the countries had the same housing scenario or credit. The foreign debt angle is interesting, I need to think more on it. Personally, I believe to much focus has been on the banking side, and not enough on preserving jobs. I contend that some of these banks should be allowed to fail. Why should taxpayers bail-out poor management? We even see the management continue not changing their practices when we give them money. If one of our children bought a lemon car would we continue to help them to pump money into it, or tell them to take their loses and dump it?Yes, we need to pull together, but the lead horse has to be slowed down by the others or everyone lose. Notice I said slowed down not stop.
Rollinstone ,I don't have privy to your crystal ball and I will not pretend to know if the stimulus package will work but I really don't think we have the option of doing nothing.Yes,we are prepared for inflation and eventually taxes & interest rates will have to raised but we are all in this together.You may be right ..I don't know but I am worried that our best minds will be tempted to resort to partisan politics instead of a sensible solution...
SandwichhYou are one the reasons I enjoyed Alton’s response. Alton did not use the usual right-wing talking points from talk radio and he never once did any name calling.Ron Paul is a lone wolf and no one pays attention to him (except for his flock) and in the debates he was mocked by his own party and rejected at the ballot box...I can remember a thread a couple years, when I came to his defense because of the way he was being treated.Japan did fail and they did a ten year rebuilding no question, our present treasury secretary helped them through it but one distinction we are in a WORLD financial crisis…You know that import/export thing =trade imbalance.Plenty of time to place blame and I never said Barney Frank or the Dems never had any blame coming to them..I have said in my blogs they were not at fault for the leverage schemes or credit defaults…..Read.Inauguration, campaign rhetoric, etc. have nothing to do with this stimulus package ;all it does is play into the hands of the ideologue food fights.
Frankly, I'm tired of all the bickering and fighting among these grown and I use the word loosely, politicians. I'm thinking about sending my two grandkids up there since they are so good at bickering and fighting. Why wasn't a lot of dust raised about the money that was thrown at the banks and Wall Street? How much pork was in that first stimulus package?It's very disconcerting to see this country going to hell in a handbasket and yes, our grandchldren and their kids will have this added burden to pay for. How much has the Iraq debacle cost so far? When are the Chinese and other countries going to recall their debt?Will this stimulus package work? No one knows, but something needs to be done.One more thing, I'm glad God gave me a brain to think with. I don't have to listen to these idiots on talk radio to make up my mind.
In the back of my mind, why am I imagining how they are going to report this down the road?. Once this welfare package, or stimulus package or whatever you want to call it, fails and brings America to it's knees, the Democrats and MSM will blame the Republicans for it because the Republicans didnt get behind it. Mark my words, it will all be their fault for voting against it. Why is there no outcry at the Democrats who voted against it? Maybe the Repubs are finally seeing the light and listening to their voters and beginning to worry about not having a cushy job to rely on next round.
In the past few months the Federal Reserve has expanded the money supply considerably, some say by a factor of two. This has had little effect ...yet. The reason is banks aren't lending and the consumer has been doing without and started saving what little they can.But this is a powder keg and the stimulus package is the fuse. Once people realize that inflation is increasing there be a lot of incentive to spend cash before it devalues or becomes worthless. There will be a loud boom and the sky will be lit up. After the smoke clears - then what?We will probably be left with an inflation hangover, stagflation like we had in the Seventies. Inflation with high interest rates that throttle capital investment and slows business. That's the flaw in the "Keynesian Multiplier" it assumes interest rates don't change. Few will lend money today knowing that next year they will be paid back in de-valued dollars. They will demand higher interest rates.This huge expansion of the money supply is unprecedented I hope they know what they are doing. Because we are going to borrow/print a lot of money for the stimulus package that appears to do little but expand government particularly renewable energy. The subsidy for the "smart grid" is pure pork for the renewable energy lobby.
Nice to see the Dems who say they are doing all things for the children have now saddled their children and grandchildren with a massive pork bill they will have to pay for with massive taxes and fees, which are the same thing. Also the most government take over in US history. Makes the socialist warning become more real as it goes along.This bill has little to do with jobs. It makes up a small amount. Ever read it? Not a refined version of CNN or MSNBC, THE BILL. If you say that orgs like ACORN are not getting any of the money you have NOT read the bill.This is a big waste bill. Just like the one that the Dems sent out of Congress last time. Remember, the Dems have had a majority in Congress for the past two years. And Congress writes the spending and tax bills, not the White House. As per The Constitution.And Barney Frank had nothing to do with the mortgage upheaval? Put the Kool Aid down and change the channel. A powerful congressman waves much power and mind changing.Ron Paul is one of the sane voices up there now. Japan came out of their lost decade by finally letting things fail and rebuilding. They are only putting it off here, like Japan did by bailing banks and all out before they woke up.Private jets that came in for the last Bush inauguration, 400. Private jets that came in for the Obama inauguration, 600. MMMM....who has a private jet fetish? Waste and global warming only appears if it concerns other than Dems looks like.Another I told you so.
Hello AltonI enjoyed your civil response and I do see your point on many of the issues you wrote about.The Democrats should never run roughshod over the minority; this is not a time for “turnabout is fair play.” NBC’s Andrea Mitchell calls the first passage; a Rush Limbaugh v Barack Obama standoff since all of the republicans in the house are in conservative districts. No moderates in the house.Let me define stimulus that the republicans and democrats agree on….A stimulus is as one republican puts it “primes the pump” and is meant to be short term so the government needs to spend money to stimulate demand…We still have enormous wealth but consumer spending is at an all time low.Moody’s Investment Service study on stimulus produced these results.Every $1 spent on food stamps generates $1.73 in stimulusEvery $1 spent on infrastructure generates $1.59 in stimulusEvery tax cut to taxpayers generates $1.03 in stimulusA corporate tax cut would generate a $.30 (that’s cents) in stimulusYou may be right about Citicorp and the corporate jet and your business psychology theory but I think 9 days is too short of a period to come to any conclusion.I see the world financial crisis (which we created) as being divided into three different causes.1) The collapse of consumer spending and confidence cause by plunging home prices.2) Lending has stopped in our credit society3) Our trade imbalance I wrote that blog in response to hearing that this week alone 100,000 have been laid off…I think we might agree that staggering numbers like that will lead to higher crime rates, stress related problems, domestic violence and divorce, increased abortion, and suicides…So I think the dollars figures are never mentioned for the byproducts of a depression like era. I think that is why some of the non-job creating social programs are being put in this bill.Your post got me to thinking. I hope that was one of your intentions because this issue is too important for idealogical food fights ...IMOI takeit your message was "EVERYONE CAN AND SHOULD BRING SOMETHING MEANINGFUL TO THE TABLE IN A TIME OF CRISIS."
I guess I am missing something here, does anyone expect any objection of any bill by the elected Republican officials to mean anything? Their votes mean zip, Nada, zero, nothing. The Democratic Party has a super majority in the House, and we are still waiting to find out about the Senate. Many people are critical of these few remaining Republicans for not speaking out more. But I contend that even if they were screaming, their voice is drowned out the mass number of Democrats. Until and if the Republican party is ever able to gain even a simple majority of either house, their voice and influence will be limited . You state that they are looking at every line of the bills and double checking it, and contend it is to avoid letting the working poor and community organizations don't get a dime. You must have missed the proposal of the Republicans that wanted to cut in half the tax the lowest tax rates. Not this would have been a real relief to the working poor, money they would have seen within weeks of President Obama's signature. It would be an immediate stimulus for the working poor. Oh, I forgot, only the Democrats have ever done anything to help the working poor, so people should not listen to conservatives in either party and even moderate Republicans. The only reason that Citicorp backed away from the corporative jet issue, it was to hot of an issue, and they are asking for more bail out funds. It makes me laugh when someone states that meeting with people they oppose to get their input, they actual plan on doing something about the "input" One of the theories taught in business psychology class is, if you have upset employees, just form a employee suggestion committee. Let the committee met with an administration rep each mouth and voice their suggestions. It calms down many employees. The company may even take a low cost suggestion like a department party, just to show they are listening, when in fact they never plan on doing anything of substance. I contend that it was not the housing or poor lending practices that caused this economic crisis, but it was the cost of petroleum. The same cause of our economic crisis in the 70's.