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OH I was thinking about the bill as it was pushed through Congress.
I think people show up to voice their opinions on the health care. Where did they move the meeting?
I didn't mean to imply that there won't be anyone to vote for Obama' agenda, I know better than that.
I taught school for over 20 years, had 4th through 6th grade most of my career. Later I taught special ed Social Studies and Reading. Reading was easy. We used the library books. But Social Studies was difficult, and my students could not read the books. 8th grade had American History, 7th had Texas and 6th had World Geography. I had all three subjects at the same time. I had to find materials they could work on independently or in small groups. It was a challenge.
I still work with handicapped children but parttime as a volunteer. I love the hours.
I like your answers about teachers not relying on textbooks because my daughter is a teacher, working from 6:00 AM to 6:00 PM(driving time included) having to supply some materials out of her own pocket ,and yes having to improvise and find alternate ways of teaching. I have a healthy respect for educators.
Remember, it's not only republicans that will vote, so you can't say all are gonna try to stop the Obama agenda (your words) but some will want a continuation, others will want more, some will just be voting for republicans and democrats... The November 3 exit polling data will tell.
It's no longer the healthcare bill; it's the healthcare law..... I see that tonight's healthcare reform forum has an overflow crowd,so they are moving it to a larger auditorium... In this conservative district; that means there's a lot of questions. Why all the questions, if there is a predetermined hatred of this law?
Teachers don't rely on textbooks but like to have up to date ones to work with. Many find their own materials and find things more suited to their individual students. But it is sad that education is not a priority.
I never would bet on what the voters will do or even who will vote. So anything can happen. This time it is about liking what Obama will do or wanting to stop his agenda. Depends on how important it is to them. I can't believe he is doing some of the things he is doing now, seems he is shooting himself in the foot.
Right now I think the will of the people is to not have that health care bill and they don't like the way it was pushed trough Congress. The article you linked seems to indicate that the Republicans do not intend to do anything about health care, and I think everyone agrees that we need some type of reform.
lbj"The voters are already on the side of those voting out the progressive movement in spite of every liberal candidate trying to save their seats wanting to slam any idea they present on a biased media. Look they have too much to lose, they are sheltering in place. "
That is just a partisan political statement.... I know this won't penetrate because that is your deep-seated feeling and of course that's OK.... Again, we live in a multicultural country where the word "voter" is not a one size fit all. In the 2008 general election about 150 million people voted; the off-season elections usually produce about half that much. I will give you 60%,so that is 90 million will vote and we'll give you the same margin of victory. That's only about 54 million people, you call voters rebuking the progressive moment(whenever that is)in perspective Barack Obama received 69 million.... I might be wrong but historically, only about half of the people vote in off-season elections..... I understand the frustrations of losing two straight election (2006 & 2008) but if the Republican Party does not take the house; it will be considered a loss.
Rest assure that I don't post my dreams in this forum...I know you will not read the results because your mind is made up but others might enjoy the results.
"Those numbers are no endorsement for President Obama's plan, but the survey also found a deep-seated desire for change that could pose a problem for Republicans. Only 25 percent in the poll said minimal tinkering would suffice for the health care system. "
Bottom line democrats like the law but republicans don't..What's new? Damage it just your opinion based on speculation.You posted "I really don't put much faith in anyone, I am voting away from a force that has been less than honest with voters and has demonstrated an abuse of power over the will of the people and plans to do more of the same.
What is the will of the people? We live in a multicultural country, how can one opinion be a one size fit all?
I believe presidents put their children in private school because of security but president Obama answered that direct question from a lady this morning, by saying that Washington, DC's public schools are not up to par and those they can afford to put the children in private schools, will do so. The president budgeted $4 billion (most ever) to try and get at the bottom of the failures in our school system. That is a lot better than some symbolic gesture of putting their own children in the public school system.... I read where 67% of those polled gave our educational system a C or below and that 65% are willing to pay more Federal taxes to get that done. Were they lying to the pollsters to make themselves feel good? I don't know. I just read this morning that Texas will cut back on education,such as funding textbooks, science lab funds, and pre-kindergarten... I know Texas has to operate on a balanced budget but reducing funds for such programs will only hurt us in the future. I wish they would look elsewhere.
The voters are already on the side of those voting out the progressive movement in spite of every liberal candidate trying to save their seats wanting to slam any idea they present on a biased media. Look they have too much to lose, they are sheltering in place.
You are dreaming if you think that changes in insurance policy that people are already paying for is going to sell them on health care. They know a good health care plan would have done the same and not done all the damage this one will do. I, too, hope there will be changes that will be addressed.
I really don't put much faith in anyone, I am voting away from a force that has been less than honest with voters and has demonstrated an abuse of power over the will of the people and plans to do more of the same.
Why do Presidents put their chlildren in private schools? What does it have to do with this? The public schools do not meet the needs of the children and it's because of the limits on how to teach and goals that do not reflect good education that keep schools from producing the best educated students. Rather than change things so public schools could teach effectively, those who can afford to, send their children to private schools. Same I've got my rear covered, to heck with you.
BTW While are we are discussing the small things like the tea party, definition of socialism, and other trivia matters; the treasury secretary was in China last week trying to convince them that it will be in their self interest to do something about our trade deficit whether it's revaluing their their money, lowering tariffs or allow more of our goods in their marketplace...You see, outsourcing is here to stay because a self respecting CEO is supposed to satisfy his shareholders, China has an endless supply of cheap labor, and they are not that concerned about environmental issues. It'll be interesting to see how the republicans vote next week when the democrats bring up a vote to take away the tax incentives of those companies shipping their jobs overseas....Unless the parties get serious; unemployment will stay high and we will continue to look for scapegoats and not solving issues.
I did like you statement " is my opinion: When Republicans stick their necks out and give too much info, Democrats jump on it and try to damage it. So they reflected this in their pledge. "...Hello pot, the republicans are proud of being the party of No.... So they are supposed to be secretive with their plans and ideas? If it was so wonderful,they would all be on " Meet the Press", shouting from the rooftop, and the voters would agree.
You have a great Sunday.
jbjI used Fox and MSNBC as a metaphor to say unless you are brain washed by either network; it doesn't really matter what you view. When you start posting in the forum, other posters will determine your bias, knowledge, and fairness.
Again, you're determined to choose a certain place in time(poll on health care) and make that a permanent fixture.... No reasonable person can say that the 31 million new recipients of Health Care and those who will be the beneficiary of the new aspects of the law, that went into place last Thursday, will not like the new law... Fact is insurance costs were skyrocketing for years and republicans neglected the issue; many republicans agreed with 80% of what was in the bill and they continued to say they only needed to work on the other 20%... As I've said, it's not a perfect bill and I'm glad that the new republican majority will try to fix some aspects of it... We shall see.
You give away too much credit to people with three pointed hats and signs... Factions of populist groups have been around for a long time; in 1992 it was the Ross Perot who got 20% of the vote; Ron Paul is the de facto, leader of the Tea Party Revolution but it has evolved to lobbyist such as Dick Armey and his crew to Sarah Palin and Michelle Bachmann... The current tea party operates on a slogan like" smaller government and less taxes," as the president said" what are your solutions? Where do you want to cut?".... It's easy to shout talking points; it's much harder to govern or have ideas of how to govern. i.e. Tea partiers never mention outsourcing or trade imbalances, which has everything to do with high unemployment. They never mention run away defense spending or the financial schemes of Wall Street.... It's pretty much" government bad" only ,when a democrat is in office. They complain about government run Health Care but most of them have VA or Medicare...You see, Social Security, VA, and Medicare are by definition, socialist programs that president Obama inherited. By definition the public library and free public education are considered socialist programs... The current tea party tries to qualify it by calling the president, a European-styled socialist.... Instead of the semantic war; they should concentrate on the real problems of the nation... They were relatively silent when BP created the worst environmental hazard of our lifetime..... That's why I don't have any respect for them; they are just a a self- centered " I've got mine",mob.... It's a good thing that they only represent about 20% of the nation.
I don't know what president Obama entering his children in private school has to do with our educational system and its problems.
I noticed that you never mentioned campaign finance reform or a logical explanation a why our cash strapped nation needs to fund missile defense.
Here is my take on the education part:
Regarding education: Being a teacher I can assure you that what I have seen from Washington does not give me much confidence in a plan they might have. Obama, like some other presidents in the past, put his children in private school. (I put my own children in private school and did so because I thought their needs would be best met there, so I am not being critical) But he then signed away the chance for poor children to get vouchers to go to the school his daughters attend. So far, I am still in the factual area.
Here is my opinion: Washington has not been the best judge of how to teach or how to determine effective teaching. Children, especially poor children, need to be given a different option. But the real problem is that we are not operating effectively in many of our schools. Children come to school with different needs and different skills. This is a plus. We need to work with this instead of trying to change it. I could write a book on how to do this, but cannot fit my answer in this little box. But to make a long story short, standardized tests are not the best way to judge a school, or teachers. They can pinpoint needs of individuals or of groups. Principals sometimes place students with teachers based on needs of the students and skill of the teacher. Individual progress might be a good indicator of teacher effectiveness, but spending months of the school year to teach to a standardized test does not necessarily mean the test will give valid group results. Or beneift the students. So I don't have a plan for education and cannot back anything I have seen from Washington.
I would like to see how people with very different opinions can work together because it is the future of our country. Understanding each other is a start. Finding a middle ground is important, but people often read and quote what they believe and there is plenty out there which covers all bases. My own observation is that each wing thinks it is my way or the highway.
Mike, I am for working together to get something done that works. It certainly has not been successful without cooperation between the differing opinions. Bias is hard to identify if you agree with it. That is the case with Fox and MSNBC.
I asked the questions I asked because I wanted to understand your opinions. Congress is dealing with exactly what we are, very opposing views and I thought going back to the source might lend some insight. You are a reasonable human being. You have assimilated issues in one way or another, either by dismissing them as untrue or accepting them.
Here are some facts, over half the people in the USA disagree with many parts of the health care bill and even tho congress knew this, they passed it. This is my opinion: The US government wanted to take over health care and change parts of it and the result is that it will work less effectively for the majority of the population, and raise costs. This concerns me very much. For this reason, and other related ones, I have lost my respect and trust for this administration and congress.
The Republicans do not have to have a plan that you or I agree with. They have to have one the voters accept. I do not think the pledge gave much info, but if the tea party candidates were consulted there would have addressed the balancing the budget issue. And the tax one, which, believe it or not, they do have some options for taxing. Most people realize money trees don't grow in Washington and they have to have taxes to operate. This is my opinion: When Republicans stick their necks out and give too much info, Democrats jump on it and try to damage it. So they reflected this in their pledge.
Now, unless you want to go back and study the issues and comeback with some documented answers, please ignore my blog in the future because I really don't want to resort to the delete button.... It can be your opinion but unless we can both put known talking points aside and discuss the merits of legislation or proposals; it becomes a fruitless exercise in gibberish..... You can be as critical as you want about democratic proposals or the president of United States(sometimes they might merit it) but the least you can do is back up your statements with documented facts and a reasonable, well thought out alternative.... If you disagree with a policy, offer a viable solution.... Just because you watch Fox and I watch MSNBC doesn't the mean we can't formulate an opinion on our own.
I'm going to try one more time, to reason with you.... You insult what little intelligence I might have left by asking me to answer Sean Hannity, Glenn Beck ,Rush Limbaugh, Andrew Brietbart type questions.... I admit, prior to the elections, I took part in the nonsense. The topic is the GOP, Pledge to America not Barack Obama. I have repeatedly warned you to stop trying to change the subject by resorting to left/ right issues that were settled a long time ago but you continue to try to use it, to mask your lack of economic or political knowledge... You go back to what you are comfortable with. It takes a couple days to come up with a topic, a lot of hours to research the subject, and then another couple hours to write it, and in just a couple minutes; a rude poster will use it to deliver his infomercial. I'm going to try to cleanup my blog by using that delete button because I'm interested in getting feedback, rather than just everyday talking points, that really doesn't amount to much.
After the election, I knew that the democrats were going to be put on defense but I honestly thought that the republicans would have alternative plans that met CBO scrutiny. That didn't happen, so it's been about 20 months of bashing from your side....The tables have turned because the national republicans have submitted the “Pledge to America."... It puts them on record.
I asked you some serious questions and you answered with an infomercial...
1. The tax cutting proposals in the pledge cannot be paid for unless they are followed with some extreme cuts in Social Security and Medicare because I don't know a republican (except Robert Gates) that wants to cut defense spending.2. The government has more bills than revenues, so evidently you think it's OK to go further into debt to pay for more ICBM (and who will we use them against?) Instead of paying down on the deficit and the debt.3. The pledge to the voters was supposed to be a "trust me" document? Don't worry if I spent months on this document by talking to the folks and just because I forgot to mention a fundamental objective; you know I want to balance the budget...Ha4. I never said anything about government run education but we still have the Department of Education and the good GOP answer could've been for more private vouchers or uniform standardized testing. I never said anything about government creating any more jobs...A good republican answer could have been to reduce reforms that are not conductive to productivity, releasing the tax burden, so the companies can become more profitable, as was mentioned in the buzz words" job killing bills."
I really meant that a lobbyist usually makes about as much as they made in congress (depends on their expertise and contacts) but they don't have to answer to any constituents and the golf course is a much better venue to conduct business, than the house floor. Last I heard there were 15,000 registered lobbyists throwing out about $3.25 billion to willing representatives, trying to influence their vote.
I don't know for a fact but I'm willing to bet that a majority of Washington politicians do not take in large amounts of lobbyist money but that most of the money goes to those that serve on influential committees. That's the reason I don't paint with a broad brush.
Meg Whitman (former CEO of EBAY and currently running for the governor California) has spent $119 million of her own money and her opponent has only spent about $1.85 (I'm kidding) but I don't think tightwad Jerry brown has spent $1 million yet, they're in a virtual tie.... It goes to prove that the United States is not broke, the money's here, is just not going for consumer spending and jobs.
You don't sound like a cynic but more like an informed citizen...
Mike, I have to think more about those questions. Here are my thoughts. While the budget and middle class may not have been addressed in the pledge, believe me it will be in a plan to repair the system. If any tea party candidate win, both will be a main concern. A strong military will be at the top of the list, and the missile funding may have been part of self defense for the home front. I am not for government run education, jobs need to come from the private sector, and what did you expect to see with campaign finance in a pledge?
Now here are some questions.
1. When Obama ran for president, did you know he would turn this country so far left?
2. Did you think his associations with socialists and terrorisits such as Ayres were just fine?
3. Do you approve of his czars and are you aware of their backgrounds? Google "safe school czar" before you answer.
4. Did you understand what Obama really meant by "change you can believe in"? Do you feel he kept his promises?
5. Do you think it is ok for our Dept. of Justice to fail to prosecute cases when the victim is white? (the second employee is now charging that this is true)
It is fine with me for Democrats to stand behind this administration in many areas, but I cannot believe that honest, good Americans are comfortable with some of the above concerns.
The new Republican majority will end during Obama's second term.
Too many items to address here.
No spin. No spin. No spin?
Hello Mr. Pot, have you met Mr. Kettle?
The rest just isn't worth the time.
I am tired of the Republicns lying to me. all they do is promise you the moon but do nothing. at least the democrats are trying to do the things in their adjenda even if you don't agree with it.
Jon Stewart's take on the "Pledge"...
Wash, rinse, repeat!
Mike...You may be right about the congress critters using their office as a path to more money. One thing I would disagree with is that you think they are looking to make a lot of money by going to work at a lobbying firm after leaving office. I believe they are looking to make a lot of money FROM the lobbyists WHILE they're still IN office. Admittedly, it's probably only a subtle difference. That's why they want to be on Ways and Means. They can command larger "campaign contributions" from the lobbyists who want tax laws written to exclude their rich clients. I have said before that patriotism in our representatives and senators has mostly been replaced by the lust for power and perks. Why else would someone spend millions for a job that pays $174,000? They know the salary is just the starting point for making REAL money. All they have to do is keep the lobbyists happy and the money just keeps rolling in. Gee, do I sound like a cynic?
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You have got to pick one and make it better...:-)
Is that Independent and voting GOP or some one running on something other than Dem or GOP?
Have a good weekend
The booklet is about 45 pages as I stated originally but the the pledge itself is 21 pages.
As usual you side-steeped the questions but just submitted with something you were comfortable with like how you will answer.
It doesn't have to be a right or wrong but questions left unanswered is a snub.
1. Does the math work out in the GOP pledge?2. Why would the GOP fund missile defense?3. Why was balancing the budget left out?4. A Nexus-Lexis reveled that the poor was not mentioned and Middle-class was only mentioned twice but tax cuts were mentioned 64 times...Why is that?5. Why no mention of education,future jobs to invest in or campaign finance?
Mike what I read said, "full text" and it was 48 pages including pictures.
You and I do not disagee 100% of the time, but our divisions are significant.
I will remember to start my comment with "I think" or "I may be wrong". Actually, I have done that.
I assure you I have read the pledge. Have you? The main point is that the republicans have been on idle for about 20 months but they told the voters that they would present their ideas for the next two years, before the election. I believe you said you were a teacher; what would you do if you gave your students six months to prepare an essay and then they turned in something that looks like an overnight project? The democrats didn't submit a pledge ,so there's nothing to compare.
You are talking about that " Alice in Wonderland" world again.... The plan Mitch McConnell and Jim DeMint devised did not have anything to do with the voters... It just like when Newt Gingrich shut down the government... These are the gimmicks politicians use every day to get the upper hand. A lot of pundits have said that the rope-a-dope tactics the republicans used were brilliant, because it takes advantage of the anger out there, without having to submit ideas, which might draw the same anger. I believe I provided sources and in the rare case where I inserted a personal opinion, I followed it with " I think" or " I may be wrong," so that is not spin. You may not(and about 100% of the time you don't) agree but that's your prerogative.
Mike, much of the pledge sounds like something either party could have written. And should have. To which part do you think I applied a spin?
I would hate to think that our wishes do not sway our reps. Regardless of their goals, the plan of the voters is not to bring down a president, it is to move our country in a direction other than hard left.
I was not talking about the pledge when I mentioned brainstorming, but the ideas some of the senators and house members come up with.
If you think your sypnosis is without spin, step back and take a look.
Do you just read a few words and go directly into spin mode?
The pledge is supposed to be a plan on how the Republican Party will govern in the next two years; according to minority leader John Boehner....Andy Roth VP of The Club for Growth said that at plan was"milquetoast" because the Pledge has not [sic] teeth,” he said. “Voters have no reliable assurances that House Republicans will behave appropriately.”
I certainly am not a republican but I know the talking points of small government, less taxes(preferably no taxes) and a balanced budget.... The pledge left out balanced budget .
I seriously doubt that Jim (Waterloo) DeMint and Mitch McConnell have any idea who you and you certainly weren't a factor in their decision to vote no. It was a strategic plan, to bring down a popular president at the time. They voted no against republican ideas like " pay as you go" a bipartisan committee to reduce the deficit/debt and just recently against a jobs bill that they had devised several years ago. Many times Jim DeMint single-handedly held up presidential appointees.
Congressman Ryan and Colburn are respected members of the Republican Party who submitted that piece of legislation I posted... It was not brainstorming; it was legislation they submitted. Congressman Ryan has a book out that he co-authored with a couple other republicans; calling themselves young guns.... You should read that book if you want insight into the Republican Party of tomorrow.
The last person I know that made a living off his congressional salary was Henry B. Gonzalez of San Antonio... Remember him? I think he had about $35.00 in savings and he regularly slept in his office. I don't think Bill Clinton,Harry Truman,Gerald Ford or Richard Nixon were millionaires prior to being president..... The fact-finding missions I was referring to was the BP spill, areas after a devastating flood and countries that receive foreign aid. Iraq and Afghanistan might be worthwhile fact-finding missions. ... I agree the junkets the lobbyist pay for should probably be eliminated.
You can not punish the representatives because they probably could do a lot better in the private sector.... They're in the public sector because it's a stepping stone to a senate seat or an eventual lobbyist firm. They would all like to be on the House and Ways (taxing laws) or the banking committee because it just leads to a lucrative salary with a law firm who would love to put their name on their stationary.
Thanks you very much for the complements but many would disagree with you...:-)
Mike, you have an interesting comment: "I don't think we would have many members of Congress, if they had to pay for expenses out of their own pocket.... It would open the door for only the rich and it would eliminate a lot of fact-finding trips except those paid by lobbyist."
I don't have the numbers, but perhaps you do. I wonder how many members of either house are NOT multi-millionaires. I think it'd be a good idea if all congress critters flew commercial (coach) instead of USAF 757s. There might be some changes to the federal rules concering air travel in this country. How long has it been since we've had a president who wasn't a millionaire? Eisenhouer? And, I wonder how many facts pertinent to the bills being considered in Congress are found on those "fact finding" trips. Seems to me that the ones I hear about are to places with great golf courses, beautiful beaches (or ski slopes) and expensive shopping.
I'd love the opportunity to vote for someone who's been in the private sector for thirty years or more, perhaps is retired and feels the urge to SERVE the country the way the Founders intended. Heck, maybe even someone like YOU. I don't always agree with you, but I do always respect the fact that you reseach very well the topics on which you write and your writing is clear and you make your points well. I think you'd make an excellent congress critter -- except that I think you're not a multi-millionaire.
you are right born2b, this does contain some of the things Obama promised. People did vote for him because of some of these things, but his own base did not allow him to follow through with some of it, and some was just not done. I don't know if the people will try again but what choice do they have? Either they like what Obama is doing or they will vote the other way.
Mike, this is a pledge, not a plan for repairing the economy.
I guess I am partly to blame for the Republicans getting the reputation for voting NO. Well that would be me and plenty of others. When legislation for bigger government and more spending came along, we called relentlessly and asked that they vote NO unless there was a chance to vote H NO. They listened to the people they represent.
As far as individual members of congress getting bright ideas and trying to get everyone to run with them, they all are brainstorming and we will hear these and plenty of others. Some will sound ridiculous, but they are just getting ideas out there. If it comes up as a bill, I am sure it will be voted down unless it is sound.
That's what I was trying to emphasize; this pledge of theirs is just smoke and mirrors because prominent members of their party have other ideas.
They are trying to push the unpopular Health Savings Account again but these days people don't have any extra money.
"Many of those ideas come from Rep. Paul Ryan, R-Wis., one of a group of younger lawmakers trying to energize the party leadership.
Along with Sen. Tom Coburn, R-Okla., Ryan sponsored legislation that would begin to wean the middle-class away from job-based coverage and replace Medicaid with private insurance for most low-income people."
Now why doesn't that surprise me. Do unto others but leave mine the h3ll alone.
born2BmeYou might be right but I think the battles gonna be between the tea party and the general establishment republicans. Many far right conservatives are not happy because the GOP did not go all out to completely dismantle the health care law and they hid some of the social issues like traditional marriage and abortion and on the back pages of the pledge. That's according to some right wing blogs.... The democrats are going to lose several blue dog conservative democrats(I think) so for the most part, the party will be trying to regroup but they might be part of the gridlock I anticipate will happen.
I don't think we would have many members of Congress, if they had to pay for expenses out of their own pocket.... It would open the door for only the rich and it would eliminate a lot of fact-finding trips except those paid by lobbyist.
BTW there are a group of republicans that want to eliminate companies paying for their employees Health Care.
If people are smart, they will know this for what it is. It's no different than the promises that President Obama made when he knew it wouldn't be easy, if not impossible, to carry out without cooperation from the other side. That cooperation will never come because the Democrats know that they have 2 years to play the same game that the GOP did for the last 2 years and prpobably get the same results.I think it's time to start treating members of Congress the same way they expect companies to treat their employees. No government-paid healthcare, retirement benefits, travel expenses, etc. Let them pay for everything out of their pay, just like we have to.