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born2BemeYou are correct that it is a business perogative to make changes. And most business's go through cycle's. This particular business will try this platform for a while and may keep it or change to a different platform later. But here are a few people off the top of my head that will probably never post on this site when it is transformed to the facebook format. From what I understand you will have to use your real name unless you get some kind of exception. Anyone who works for local city, county, or state government will not post for obvious political reasons. Government enviornments are very political regardless of the department, I know because I have worked in them before. They will never go on record difinitively stating anything as it will be a reflection on their department. In the private sector, anybody who holds a license to perform their job will not post on here. Examples are teachers, accountants, bankers, attorney's, doctors, LPC's. Any occupation that requires them to carry E and O insurance or malpractice insurance strongly discourage these professions to participate in social network sites as clients will solicit advice from these forums leaveing an unneeded liability exposure that can be avoided by transacting business in a normal fashion. Some occupations have strong anti-fraternization policies which these sites tend to lead to. My employer discourages us from using these sites and if we do, they let us know that they look them up to see what is on them. All social networks are blocked from my place of employment because they are viewed as goof-off time. If we are on break, they have all news stations unblocked. This new policy will be fine for retired people, stay at home mom's or dad's, and for people who do not hold professional employment.
I look at it this way. We are guests here and have no more rights than we would have at a friends house. We wouldn't expect our host to change for us, now would we? It is our choice to either stay and live by the new rules, or not. It's that simple.Many applaud this new move, and many do not. To each his own.
Yes I have sent many e-mails and several folks on this site know my identity. That is not my problem with Facebook. I am very uncomfortable with the commercial aspect of Facebook. They do sell ID's and other information and us anarchist try to keep a low profile.
I have not decided my path as yet but I will stay the course. My avatar and call-sign is very important to me as it has a great deal of meaning so I will try to hang on to them.
lol, Google yourself and know what the world knows about you. I have alerts on John Anthony larva sent to me. I Google everyone I meet and know online and in real life, even do criminal checks. Its sad, everyone is more interesting than me. Its funny, arrest records.
Sit tight everyone. The weaning process is obviously more involved and lengthy for some than others
Maybe some things just never end.
The banned flying under the radar will get a new awaking in two weeks...That's a plus for FB and those converting will type in a few words and many of us will say "Oh,that's who they are."....Avatars and aliases can be changed out as quickly as a t-shirt but the words and thoughts won't , or they will lose the reason they wanted to post on a public forum in the first place....I wonder if comment history will remain.
Word is a wonderful place to store "mea culpas."...:-)
I think more than one of you who have posted on this thread need to pause and reflect back.
Ask yourself this question, "Have I ever sent an email to anyone on the Advocate forum and revealed my true identity?"
Some of you have very poor short term memories.
LOL, I didn't expect you to get it Vet.
Hey jump ship and run with those that "claimed" they are as well, you won't hear me crying.
And by the way - why do we jump all over the info that major news media releases as the truth - but it is released under conditions of anonymity - but we want commenters to blogs to be transparent?
Facebook is such a powerful tool! I could have 15,000 friends - all but 5 of them I have never met. I can tell you what most people had for supper last night - not that I care. I can tell you how many people are looking for you to join their pitty party by the way they lead in with comments - hoping you bite. I can view some pictures that shouldn't even be shared with family, much less the world.And I purchased a new laptop because it seems something I thing I got - or should I say the computer wizard said I got from Facebook.Don't think I need another Facebook account - and I will always wonder if I am really deleted from the Facebook world.
Seems to me Advocate is a small town newspaper - don't understand why it can't stay that way - but of course being one of those old farts that isn't always into change - no one cares anyway.
Of course the best info is always exchanged at the coffee shop! Where you really get to see the face of the person you are having a discussion with.
Something to consider, I’m just saying.
1.Searches in Facebook will bring up Victoria Advocate more often, because of the way Facebook is designed. That was one of the arguments Google had online, with searches related to Google and Facebook.
2.Accessing your personal information is much easier.
3.More control over advertising, not sure if Victoria Advocates team of “egg heads” know this but as I do not get paid, figure it out.
4.The United States government has been quietly and secretly pressuring social networks to create backdoors and making available personal information of users. Not to imply that the Victoria Advocate has had any correspondence with Homeland Security, the F.B.I., etc…
5.Facebook has pretty much bend over for the Government.
6.With Facebook’s API’s, less work for the Victoria Advocates “egg heads”, more time to goof off.
7.Able to access friends list of users, to expand user base.
8.I really can go on but why?
Why does any company do anything, to do something that has the potential to make more money or reduce cost, duh!
The biggest concern, if I was an average person would be privacy but as that I’m not; I really don’t care. This will be a great help to law enforcement's cyber division, sorry guys, it will!
I’m sure the Victoria Advocate, knows nothing about that, lol! Using Facebook, makes it easier for cyber cops to do their job, I even had one tell me this to my face once.
So, go ahead and get in line with the rest of America.
I’m waiting to see if Buffet makes Victoria Advocate an offer to sell out, or has he already?
Do you guys have stock, lol, seriously, lol.
Facebook has been very good to me. It is the number one source of downloading viruses and Trojans into business networks and I make a lot of money due to that. As one poster has commented, I dun got me an edumication, so I don't have a Facebook account. My computer is a major component in my business. Also, Facebook makes their money selling your information and employers are now requiring access to read what you post. If my boss were a die hard democrat, I would be in trouble. For most, if your boss were non democrat...well you see how it works. It has been fun being one of the few non-liberals to post here at the Advocate.
could it be?
That's an excellent point born and that could be a vice versa...What if the boss posted his views causing him to lose potential customers and upset employees...Of course there is no perfect system and we have probably complained about all the changes our forum has made but I like to know as much as possible before signing the dotted line...It takes me 6 months before I make a major purchase and that's not saying the item I bought won't be sold two weeks later for $200 less but I feel better knowing that I have done my due diligence.
Chris said the changes won't take place for another two weeks or so,in the meantime I will be noting most of the comments.
Just how does one test a fart to determine it's age to prove it is outdated?
I say everyone sit back, take a deep breathe and lets just find out what this new toy is supposed to do. If we all rush in and claim it's horrible before we even see it, then that doesn't say much for this group of thugs here. Yes, I include myself in that.
As shocking as this may be to some of you outdated old farts, sometimes change isn't all that bad.
Vicad, light a fire under this junk heap and let's see what she'll do.
Thank you for your point. If one thinks about how some of our comments have been twisted by unhappy souls on this site think about the larger pool we will be swimming in. That is not completly a bad thing because our little part of the world could use some fresh thinking just can live without the mud slinging.
If I wanted a Facebook account, I would already have one. I do not and have no interest in opening one. Too many negative stories floating around the Internet about things that can happen if you do not dot all the i's, cross all the t's and read every word of the fine print. Good luck with this, I suspect you will need it.
I want to also remind people that many employers are asking for Facebook accounts and info that they use to screen potential new hires. Do some of you really want some of your views, and tempers, out there for the whole world to see?
Imagine how useful a tool Facebook would have been to people like Stalin/Hitler etc, if it was up & running in there day, information of peoples views would have no doubt been gathered & used against them. Much like in the days of the real Martin Luther, his books & writings were brought as evidence before him in order to indite him. Of course he would not recant, his correct decision meant certain death for many of his heretical (so called) followers.
WIL HISTORY REPEAT ITSELF? Of course it will, remember every thing you say can & will be used against you. Which is ok when justifiable attempts are being made by just & honest officials to apprehend true criminals with evil intentions.
Its the just & honorable part I concerned about in the future.
Once most of you who are reading this stop laughing, please think about it again & remember my words.
May The Lord Jesus richly bless you Gary White
Twitter, facebook, texting, etc. etc. etc. has given us unlimited ability to exchange information.
We have lost the ability to connect and communicate.
I have very mixed emotional regarding the Facebook change over. I thought when we signed up we provided our e-mail, name etc. Would that not identify the poster? On the other hand I understand the papers desire to civilize to site and it's users. It speaks volumes about a society that excuses rudeness and name calling as a legitimate form of debate. I have showed my family some of the comments that were directed towards me and they were hurt that people would be that cruel and insensitive. Maybe it is time to tell folks to "cowboy up" and standby their statements by showing the world their face. The problem is once your face is out there it belongs to the world by way of the internet. I have a very sweet granddaughter that has been bullied on Facebook and we can chalk that up to immature antics. This site should be populated by adults but when a poster considers some one's belief as "spewing crud" maybe it is time to rethink the forum. My daughter gave me a real shot of reality a few days ago when she showed me the "rants and raves" on Craigslist. Must be a lot of sore knuckles out there.
I think you all should of looked into how easy it is to create a "fake person" on Facebook. Just a speed bump for trolls...IMO
ChrisI believe you are making a mistake by switching to FaceBook. FaceBook is an investor owned company that demonstrated greed in an IPO that was overpriced and overissued. The biggest asset this company has is the personal information of its Members. It will only be a matter of time before investors begin cashing in on their biggest asset.
Well said, bobmunoz. Thank YOU for your thought-provoking blogs and taking a stand.
Don't fix it if it ain't broken. I am a bit saddened by all of this. FB, in my opinion is not the coattails you want to grab and go for a ride. My small contributions to the Advocate and its readers will serve as a reminder that we need to continue working to achieve what we all want: our country back, good neighbors, good schools, peace, and happiness. I will not subject my blogs to scrutiny by the FB subscribers. Thanks to all of you who participated in my forums.
So long and thanks for all the fish.
Now all we need is a poke button.
I love poking, yes, I. Love. Poking.
VBB,Let me hold that for a bit before I share. I want to learn the ins and out of Delphi first.
Don't worry, as with everything I ever wrote on Vicad, you aren't missing much.
Beakus, you seem pleased with the new transformation but yet you don't use your name......seems a bit odd to me. I will look into the Delphi site....Jason whats the name of your forum?
Thanks VicAd. I believe this should have been done even sooner. A few of the never ending bloggers with their agendas will no longer be spewing their crud anonymously, and not wanting to embarrass their family and friends will move on to other sites.
Sugar- I will take you up on your offer- I just sent you my contact info.Thank you for your kindness in offering.
My distaste for Facebook has grown to an unacceptable level- I have seen sufficient character (mine- amongst others) attacks on it's pages to know it is not an acceptable median for me. I only "joined" Facebook a year or two ago, at the request of one family member's request.
Today, I will chose an IRS audit over Facebook.
I will continue to visit this venue as part of my daily ritual, I will simply defer any comments or blogs to a more suitable venue.
The VA has been an integral part of my life since the day I learned to read- as such, I suppose I hold a degree of sadness, but it is what it is.
I wish all well with hopes of a greater Victoria County.
jasonbourne and swww - I will be seeing you soon on the Delphi forums. I am just trying my best to hold judgment here but I suspect what jasonbourne said - that the answers will not be pleasing. I do know that I have had one foot out the door here for a while, and this is the final blow. I will be posting my final blog in a day or two on the VicAd. Many of us are also on Google blogs, and I enjoy those very much. Anyone who has not visited my (or Mike's, Edith Ann's, Pilot's, or Grey-Beard Loon's) can contact me via VicAd and I will give you those web addresses. Thanx everyone for your input here. Looks like an exodus has begun.
Jason...VERY COOL! It sounds like you'll be stiff competition for VA. I'm looking forward to visiting your forum.
Thanks STWWW,I'm signed up with Delphi and already started my own forum. If I ever get someone to post on it, I'll share the link with you.
I started as soon as I read your post and wrote an opening post to my forum... 20 minutes and I'm in business.
Delphi looks pretty nice and best of all, it's easy.
Jason..."I've always been open to turning this into a wide open forum. LOL! It wouldn't take but a few days to find out how scummy some Victorians are. It would be hilarious but not for the faint of heart."
Pardner, you'd LOVE the Delphi Forums. Wide open and some of them definitely are NOT for the "faint of heart."
Born...on the Delphi forums, their systems are quite sophisticated. On the left side of the page is a listing of topics that have been posted. Each post is given a, for a lack of a better term, serial number and if you reply to a post, the system references that post on yours so you can click on it and go directly to the post.
Give Delphi a try -- and NO, I don't get a referral fee.
I've always been open to turning this into a wide open forum. LOL! It wouldn't take but a few days to find out how scummy some Victorians are. It would be hilarious but not for the faint of heart. People have a way of using special words to help explain things. I'm afraid many here are "not ready for prime time" forum use.
I like the way the Houston Chronicle does it. The Caller in Corpus is more or less like the advocate. I have seen a few of the Facebook based comment sections on other sites. I must say I am not much of a fan of those.
For me, the only attractive thing about these forums is that it is small and local. Has anyone ever tried to post comments on yahoo, or some of the political sites? By the time your post is posted and you go back to read it, it's already a few pages down. Nevermind trying to follow remarks to your post because it is impossible to find it again.
HookEm1, SugarMagnolia and Kash...I'll be spending a lot more time on the Delphi Forums. There are a great number of forums under the Delphi umbrella. My particular favorites are: The Backyard Fence; The First Amendment; and Politics, the Bully Pulpit. There are forums for literally anything you can think of and if there isn't, you can start one. Everyone uses a pseudonym and you have a profile where you can enter as much or as little as you feel comfortable with. Be warned though, some of the forums can get pretty explicit. If you like the way VA deletes comments because somebody used a magic word, Delphi may not be for you. It's like we're all grownups there and sometimes the language can get salty but if you're easily offended, there are other forums under the Delphi umbrella -- religious ones, cars, natural birth control, all kinds. There are peole from all around the world; Australia has some particularly good members. I urge you to at least give the Delphi Forums a look -- you might like them.
Maybe they gould just use the Yahoo "thumbs up/down" instead of only "like" as a reflection of sentiment.
Sugar--I think they thought this was going to be more well received than it is turning out to be. I wonder if they planned for a certain percentage to leave? It looks like a little back-pedaling to me.
Suger,Unless it is completely different from what I imagine, this change is not going to be on your list of favorite things on the planet.
Don't rush it... Let it slowly make you feel better like the sun on a cool morning. Once it arrives then we can muscle our way through it. LOL!
OK, Chris - first you said, "If you don't want to use Facebook, your comments will no longer appear on the article pages. In that sense, this is mandatory."
Then you say, "I should make clear that we will still allow for unverified comments and blogs on our site. We just will no longer promote those. Instead, we will promote people who choose to use their real identities via Facebook for comments and via the process we're establishing for bloggers."
HUH??? Still clear as mud. Or, if I'm just not getting it, please tell me now.
Could you please just answer yes or no or give specifics as applicable to these questions so I can get it straight?
1.) If we do not have a Facebook account, will we still be able to blog on the VicAd website as we have been? Will our blogs be seen online?
2.) If we do not have a Facebook account, will we still be able to post as we have been? Will our posts be seen online?
3.) Do we need to change anything other than getting a Facebook account? In other words, can I remain and will I be seen as SugarMagnolia with the same avatar on the VicAd website if my blogs and posts will be visible? I know you say "Previous Advocate identities will not be featured on our articles." but don't know if you mean the articles online as we are commenting on now, or exactly what "articles" encompasses and what "featured" really means here.
4.) What exactly do you mean by "promote" people who comply with the new VicAd-Facebook policy? Promote how? Where?
5.) Is the look of the VicAd website going to change due to this?
I appreciate your clarifications on this. Because as it stands right now, I can read your comments here but don't see any real answers thus far.
Hookem1, "Like"..."I have never understood people’s need to know, “Who said that?” If a comment is true, if it is factual, if it is well presented, what difference does it make who the author is? If a comment is none of these things, you just ‘blow it off’ and hope the next comment will be better".
I have only wondered who one person was on this thing and never put an ounce of effort to finding out. It just didn't matter. There are people here that are beside themselves trying to figure out who someone is. LOL! There have been a lot of great posts over the years but those will be replaced with "like". Anyone read the Yahoo comments? There are some very funny people posting on Yahoo's stories.
Thanks for all the fun here Vicad. It has been fun!
Chris,From the Urban Dictionary:
SNARKY – adjective – ‘any language that contains quips or comments containing sarcastic or satirical witticisms intended as blunt irony. Snarky comments often produce an almost embarrassed laugh from the listener who thinks, “I shouldn’t really laugh at what was just said, but it is so true/appropriate.”’
I will join the other non-Facebook people. I would like to thank you and the Advocate for providing this forum over the years. I have received much enjoyment and enlightenment from reading other people’s comments. It has also been an appreciated release valve to blow off steam on issues that are important to me. I will miss it.
I have never understood people’s need to know, “Who said that?” If a comment is true, if it is factual, if it is well presented, what difference does it make who the author is? If a comment is none of these things, you just ‘blow it off’ and hope the next comment will be better. I would call this communication. I guess it is time for the anonymous comment to go the way of the 32oz Coke, trans-fat and the salt shaker. Such is progress.
Again, thank you for the enjoyment received from the Advocate On-line over the years. It was fun.
Foolish move VicAd. Although I have a Facebook account (my whole family has one) - this is a poorly thought out decision. When you implement the change, I will not be commenting on articles anymore (in fact, some days I can hardly stomach the print edition) - the still-commenting 'refugees' can just wallow in their own ignorance.
Facebook is already in decline, you're supposed to GET OFF sinking ships... #facepalm
Its probably a trap.
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It goes without saying that I love this new idea. Then again, I am but one person.
It is true, I am rarely seen as much as I was in past years at VicAd because it seems more often than not - there isn't a real discussion.
It is mostly anonymous people insulting, being hateful, and downright disgusting with other people - because they can. No one knows who they are - so they have free rein to act in any manner they feel.
It is those people who have ruined it for the small percentage of people that are anonymous for other reasons.
Time will only tell how this will or won't impact VicAd online and the users of the website.
As an aside: My 70something grandmother has a Facebook account. The new security features make it easier than ever to hid your account and what you want people to see. In fact, planning birthday's and other events is a lot easier on Facebook.
Also - Facebook doesn't require anything of you except an email address. So this business of privacy and third parties collecting information is only what you make of it.
Your birthday is public knowledge, so they aren't collecting anything that isn't already two mouse clicks away.
When you sign up for a facebook, don't list where you went to school or where you have worked. It's that simple.
In fact, my grandmother decided not to do that, and when she finally added her high school and previous workplaces, she connected with dear friends she thought had died or would never see or speak to again. She has even used Facebook to find a lost relative.
While MySpace died, I don't think Facebook will ever go that route. Myspace allowed a lot of user input as far as HTML and usernames.
Facebook wants a real name (none of those hard to read characters and jibberish) and everyone's page looks the same. Meaning, your computer doesn't crash every time you try to load someone's page.
Anyway, that is my two cents and again - I am just one person.
old people hate change
Not interested here either. Having used Facebook it would seem the character limits would limit comments. Also some people get very offended if you don't share their opinion and I don't want to feel hunted down for speaking my mind. And I don't want all these other people to know my personal info. You may set your privacy settings but there are backdoor ways onto your personal accounts.
I see this as a positive change. Like many of the changes over the last several years, most people got used to them and some moved on. Good move, VicAd., IMHO.
Well, it is what it is. While I cannot understand the use of a social network that appears to foster slanderous, incorrect comments, all the while plagued with golden opportunity for identity theft-- I am certain that all concerns were weighted in the decision process.
So very much like a few others, it is now time for me to move along. I do not declare the wrong decision was made- simply that it does not fit into my world.
Wow. So, for comments to be posted, we are forced to have an account with another entity that will likely fold sooner rather than later. This is a point of no return, I'm afraid, for all involved.
My honest opinion, and I'm not being critical here, is that the VicAd stands to lose much more than they stand to gain with this move. After many, many years of readership, they have lost me with this ploy.
Wonder if the Roberts and McHaneys know how many subscribers and readers they will be losing?
Chris..."If you don't want to use Facebook, your comments will no longer appear on the article pages. In that sense, this is mandatory."
I've gotta say that this sounds like some of the business decisions I've seen where the boss tells the underling, "You aren't doing anything. DO something" and this is what the guy comes up with.
What if we read a story (for example, the dad killing his daughter's attacker) and just want to see what the comments are? Will we be allowed to simply read them without having a facebook account? 'Cause, I've gotta tell you. Facebook ain't gonna happen with me. So I guess this is Buh By.
I never knew the Advocate had a Facebook Page.So, I guess I won't be posting much longer. It's been fun!
I clicked on your FB Advocate page, and I did not find any of that robust discussion you were mentioning. One story on the Shiner murder had a lot of comments, but most everything else was without comments. Many stories had 'likes', but not so on the comments.
If the goal was to be inclusive, this appears pretty restrictive.
I agree this will be an interesting experiment, but what I think could be way more interesting is what was the thought process on this? Who thought this would be a good idea? Who thought this was the thing to do?
If you wanted to get rid of the disagreeable ones, just ban them (us?) and be done with it.
So I assume there is no reason to comment since non-Facebook comments do not appear in article.
Chris, do I understand correctly we must have a Facebook account in order to post at all? The details are still unclear to me. I do not have a Facebook account, nor will I ever have one. It is regrettable that the VicAd is so hung up on a fad that is now on the decline. What happens when Facebook disintegrates ala MySpace, etc. and some other "flavor of the week" comes along, then goes by the wayside as well?
I am, like jasonbourne, also wondering when this will take effect, but mostly if it is mandatory.
I probably missed the switch over date. Anyone know when that is?
I think the Advocate is looking for kinder, gentler comments. Which is fine. I'm predicting about a 60% drop in commentors immediately and it will increase from there once folks realize their real name is listed.
Should be fun...Good Luck to those departing!
Chris..."We let bloggers know ahead of time because they, for the most part, are active users of our site and because the new process for them is a bit more complicated than just commenting."
I didn't know about the changes that are a'coming till I read some of the comments here. I wondered why I hadn't gotten the e-mail and went back to Hotmail to look closer. Gee, silly me. I was looking for something from the Victoria Advocate. I had one from someone named Jessica Puente, a name I didn't know and I NEVER open anything from someone I don't know. It's a good thing, I guess that I didn't delete it on the spot.
I looked at the AdvoSports thing that you suggested elsewhere and yes, it will be very simple to comment. The problem is, you are commenting under your Facebook identity, not your Advocate identity. It has a drop down box, but the options there were my Facebeook name or signing out.
I don't understand why you targeted Advocate bloggers and not Advocate comment posters. It affects all posters.